The Division 2

Discussion in 'Games, Gaming & Game-demos' started by UnrealGaming, Jun 10, 2018.

  1. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    its both

    Inventory crash is a game issue
    crashing during action and gameplay is unstable system.
     
  2. Per.r

    Per.r Member

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    its not :)
     
  3. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    The inventory crash is being looked into, - work around is to set DPI scaling override to application
    the other one isn't, because its not a real issue in the first place, fix your computer. :cool:

    This is the age old case of Karen computer owner.

    See:
    DX12 is sensitive to instabilities in ways that even vulkan isn't (if not only because it allows deeper control than vulkan)
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2020
  4. -Tj-

    -Tj- Ancient Guru

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    Then what about quake champions,?

    that.bitch keeps crashing left and right, after they "fixed" nvidia+intel crash back in march 2019.. and its been like that ever since.. already deleted it 2x and dont feel like installing it for the 3rd time.

    Devision 2 in alpha and beta didnt crash for me back then @dx12. Actually only 1-2 times, but i stopped playing it.
     

  5. Mbi2011

    Mbi2011 Active Member

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    Division 2 (DX12) crashes for me on 2 different machines: stock or overclocked PC (7700k+1080ti) and stock notebook (9750h+2060). It's not just unstable oc
     
  6. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    what does an opengl game based on idtech have to do with division 2?

    its unstable graphics card (vram for the most part), sorry but that's fact.
     
  7. -Tj-

    -Tj- Ancient Guru

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    It crashes and its not hw fault., just like devision isnt.
     
  8. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    You can make that claim when you've seen the silicon stripped back under an xray and microscope, till then quit trying to deny something you don't have the capacity to prove in the face of evidence establishing it as fact.

    There exists evidence of users playing the game just fine on the hardware and drivers users claim to be a problem, thus the case is made that the systems affected are the source of the problem, not the driver.

    "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence!"

    This matter can be argued till I'm banned, so i'll just put it like i always do

    There are users with no issues, there are users who fixed their issues by informing themselves, and then there are users with their heads in the sand.

    The latter is most common.

    BTW, quake championships works for me and i can find no evidence of reported crashing in the last 2 years except for cases of users having turned the page file off.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2020
  9. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    Periodically emptying out the shader cache could help too but I have a feeling the game should crash before even reaching the main menu when it's pulling cached old or invalid shader data if these are problematic.
    Game itself has a cache for D3D12 and some D3D11 data, Microsoft has it's Windows10 cache of shader data and then AMD/NVIDIA if enabled also caches D3D12 (Or other API's) which would all have to be reset/removed to test that out.

    For some users the D3D12 diagnostics tools or what they're called optional components for the OS were also needed but this is the case of the game not even starting and just throwing a error or lack of support so that should be pretty easy to tell apart too.

    Hardware instability can be a pain too, games can be very sensitive to some things although this makes some games or game engines under various API's really effective for truly verifying stability too. Frostbite and memory for one example I know about probably more so with D3D12 and the newer games in the Battlefield series. :)


    EDIT: For the games shader cache it really shouldn't be pulling in earlier shader data but it also from memory doesn't empty or delete older cached entries so there could be a number of files in the config folder and the caches for D3D11 or D3D12 as it makes new versions and well simply ignores the earlier files I would hope.

    OS tends to make a full new shader folder for Windows updates and driver updates plus different folders for different processes and apps.


    Borderlands 3 for the current D3D12 game I'm using works in a similar way, no existing pipeline cache from what I can tell and then Windows 10 caches around 100 MB of shaders for the OS D3D cache and the games stored cache files builds up to around 800 MB of data though it also doesn't empty out it just adds to the existing cache so removing this can be helpful just be aware that the first start-up will be *lengthy* as it caches everything again.
    (But it ensures a nice empty clean cache file for the latest version of the game and it's shaders after updates or additions resulting in changes here.)

    Although from what I recall Division 2 does have a existing pipeline cache file that should aid with shader creation and caching being a bit faster.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2020
  10. Corrupt^

    Corrupt^ Ancient Guru

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    Astyanax

    Developer actually admitted to there being an issue with NVIDIA cards and DX12, still hasn't been fixed. That being said, most of my crashes are actually during "quiet" phases and not during action. Often when browsing my inventory, or hell, even when being just afk going to the toilet or something.
     

  11. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    Didn't NVIDIA outright list a Division 2 fix in a earlier driver for D3D12?

    Well a fix doesn't mean there might not be others or a game patch or later driver introduced some other issues.

    EDIT: 436.48
    (442.50 is then "Game Ready" for Warlords of New York if that matters at all.)

    Some of the older 430.x drivers listing Division 2 D3D12 as a open issue with crashing but whatever that was it seemingly got fixed.
     
  12. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    Game developers make bs claims all the times to fob people off.


    That was back in march last year and was present in 419 drivers, fixed in 425/43x drivers.

    its still fixed, the only people crashing now have instabilities they bury their heads into the sands over, or the inventory crash, which is caused by some image buffer overflowing when dpi scaling is set.

    its unfortunate that people pick vendor overclocked products that typically have less stability over reference, but its on them when they won't even do the right thing and try running reference or below reference to qualify their claims.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2020
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  13. Corrupt^

    Corrupt^ Ancient Guru

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    Already tried that too. Every game is rock solid except TD2. It's always nvlddmkm related (display driver stopped responding and recovered).
     
  14. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    did you do the core or the vram?
     
  15. Clouseau

    Clouseau Ancient Guru

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    Maybe it is just the combo of Nvidia and Intel. Do not really know. All I know is that once I got the ram issue sorted out it boiled down to mainly a vram issue. I can run other games with the vram clocked at 11500. TD2 with DX12 does not tolerate anything above or below 11200. Even at 11225 or 11250 it crashed randomly. That is with my 1080. And yes, if I run the gpu at stock it crashed randomly as well. So needed to find the right vram speed. Do not know what that translates to as being either driver, hardware, game issue or any combination thereof. Also run the game with HDR enabled. Do not know what impact that has on the whole stability train.
     

  16. Corrupt^

    Corrupt^ Ancient Guru

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    Both. I'm still convinced the issue was never fully fixed as everything else works fine running DX12 or Vulkan in other titles.

    Not to mention that everyone I know playing the game has the same issue the second they switch to DX12 (majority of them obviously have NVIDIA GPU's).
     
  17. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    it'd be hardware, Pascal and later are supposed to be better at catching and not crashing on gddr5x/6 errors (noise) but somehow DX12 just tosses everything on its head at times.

    Silicon processors are only as stable as can be measured until the first application they encounter issues with proves otherwise.
    Hence why people who get crashes in IBT don't necessarily remove the overclock.

    I've personally encountered cases where system ram being at 1T has made only GTA5 TDR quite reliably but no other game has.
    Also Oblivion throwing green artifacts with shader overclocks that nothing else had issues on.

    As a matter of odd fact i've only actually ever seen 1080,1080ti and 20 series users reporting D2 crashes, and these all use the 5x(6) 2 rising and 2 falling edge pumps to double their data transfer rates vs GDDR5.
     
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  18. Party Poison

    Party Poison Ancient Guru

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    I can tell you categorically that there is a none reproducible crash on dx12. Nvidia cards, Nothing to do with OC or CPU/MOBO/RAM.
    Always has been, Was passed back to Nvidia for Grd, came back to pre release QA, crash persisted but at random.

    Sometimes a build could run for days without a crash, others could last 30 mins.

    If it cannot be reproduced it cannot be reliably fixed.
    Was not fixed with hardware changes, Could be down to any AI NPC in any place at a specific time in the game world when player is using a certain item.
     
  19. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    The rogue agents in Warlords were a little bit too effective in stopping the player...
    (At least they don't ability spam like a certain boss did.)

    Could be any number of things, unless it could be narrowed down as more likely to happen on certain areas of the map or around certain encounters it's pretty hard to specifically get a lead on what is causing things to crash plus open world and random encounters and events it could even be some slight glitch or other problem.
    (What was that one crash bug in Half-Life 2 some QA tester found again, run in a circle 40 something times in one area of this one map and then one more and it would immediately crash. Somehow someone found that.)


    EDIT: For the game specifically there used to be a few areas with missing geometry and see through little holes and such take that with culling or lack thereof or hitting some math or other error and some small pixel sized hole could be messing everything up.

    Not entirely likely to be the case but part of the nature of how difficult it is to go over a large map and open world game and check on everything.

    EDIT: Post TU8 there was this one skyscraper in the Washington map that would fail to render properly from one side so you'd see right through it and part of the rest of the map, didn't crash but caused a hefty framerate hit for how much the GPU had to be doing suddenly that shouldn't be visible normally though usually these glitches are smaller or you just have minor clipping or floating objects that look off but don't do anything problematic.
    (Well other than wonky collision boxes and animations and yeah that didn't count as being in cover apparently..)

    Probably fixed now, I stopped playing shortly after that was released and wrapping up the Warlords expansion and content.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2020
  20. AsiJu

    AsiJu Ancient Guru

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    Wacky DX12 aside how's the game these days?

    I suppose there's not much point in returning to game without the WoNY DLC?
     

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