AMD Working on Vertical (3D) Stacking of DRAM onto processors

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Mar 18, 2019.

  1. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

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    There is a place and market for such an implementation. Most OEM products could be done like that, notebooks as well as embedded versions ofc. Generally products which are hardly upgraded in performance hardware (rather with more storage if at all). That summed up makes what, 90% of the PC market?
     
  2. Silva

    Silva Ancient Guru

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    We already have multiple types of memory on our computers: first is L cache, then DRAM, and then HDD/SDD.
    If they put ultra fast DRAM inside the CPU, it ill just act as a huge L cache. I'm sure we could pair "slower" DRAM externally as we do now.
    So imagine a +1Gb ultra fast L cache and then adding your typical 8/16/32Gb DDR4/5 externally.
    And of course having an APU with CPU+GPU+DRAM makes affordable PC's even more affordable.
     
  3. Yeah... Hynix, Samsung, etc vs Patriot, ADATA etc still a difference... in variety & upgradeability, ie as with server market. (All this I’m refering to HEDT consumer fyi)

    For HEDT consumers, you don’t know that - hell for consumer desktops you don’t know that. No one does. Only the CPU makers.

    Most being your operative word there; I’d say you have no way of knowing that. I’ll give you many. Popular ultrabook series’ such as ASUS Zenbooks include one modular RAM bay. As do the HP Envy x360s... I could go on.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 18, 2019
  4. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Guest

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    WTF? Fix your quotes. I did not write that!
     

  5. Hit refresh & go easy on the cocaine bro, take a breather man’ I’m on an iPhone...
     
  6. theoneofgod

    theoneofgod Ancient Guru

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    I know. It's just their post reminded me of that, if he ever said it or not :p
     
  7. vbetts

    vbetts Don Vincenzo Staff Member

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    I think both of you need to. @Fox2232
     
  8. chispy

    chispy Ancient Guru

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    Dear Gods of hardware let it become true ( APU with dram ( make it 8gb hbm pretty please ) on package ) , that will be the most important and logical move for APUs since the bottleneck is the ram on them.
     
    Ridiric likes this.
  9. Luc

    Luc Active Member

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    I think this article is more illustrative, also there is a video at the end where AMD's Forrest Norrod talks about all of this.

    https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-3d-memory-stacking-dram,38838.html

    By his words, I think at AMD are looking to implement Samsung's SRAM on their chiplets, instead classic caches, wich will bring more bandwidth, less consumption, less heat, bigger caches, smaller cores, and cheaper products. And they will do it when Samsung's SRAM be available at a smaller lithography node.

    There exists the possibility of using DDR or HBM with a substrate over the chips, like Intel showed with Foveros, and Radeon engineers blueprinted before. But Forrest Norrod talked about true 3D chips opposed to 2.5D, referring to SRAM lithography printed directly over the chip and impossible to separate.

    Talking about APUs with HBM, maybe we will be closer now with the new chiplet architecture. Because if they don't do something fast, Intel will have an graphic advantage at the end of the year with their new iGPU.
     
  10. scoter man1

    scoter man1 Ancient Guru

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    Just wait until they start pulling an apple. $300 for 16GB, $500 for 32GB, $1000 for 64GB. All when you could've gotten that ram way cheaper externally.
     

  11. icedman

    icedman Maha Guru

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    I would have expected hbm to have made some sort of appearance on a cpu/apu. Maybe this has something to do with cost.
     
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  12. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Guest

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    To all that... It does not matter at all. HEDT is small business, it may not be affected at start. Server will not be affected for very long time in loss of replaceable parts.
    And those tablets, notebooks. If 5% complains, they will buy older model, but they will buy anyway. Then they will bend as Apple's clients did.

    When this becomes norm, HEDT will bend in same way. Slowly, but steadily. If someone stays behind, his loss.

    Simple as that. 1st it will be option. And at time it will be norm... stubborn consumer who refuses to move forward will be non-consequential.

    Technology moves forward and 7nm opens wide door to memory density. In 3 years freaking cellphones will have 16GB of RAM as standard.
    = = = =

    But here's the secret. On that image is small TDP device like ultrabook/handheld gaming console. And getting that memory there is to have it accessible at L3 performance.
    When that happens, I am not going to say: "No!"
    I'll say: "Hell, Yeah!"
     
  13. HWgeek

    HWgeek Guest

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    Who watched google Stream?
    Looks like another Win for AMD in the gaming segment- for me it looks like they designed custom monster APU with Vega 56 + 16GB HBM2 and Zen CPU!
    What do you think about it? All consoles use AMD GPU/CPU + next gen consoles + Microsoft game streaming will use AMD's GPU's and now Google also!
    https://i.**********/BvGy33Sx/Stadia.jpg

    AMD stock right now:
    https://i.**********/Fs88PcwC/AMD.jpg
     
  14. waltc3

    waltc3 Maha Guru

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    I think it will be sold in proportional sizes and arrangements, just as it is now. One size would never fit all, etc.
     
  15. nevcairiel

    nevcairiel Master Guru

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    But that seems unlikely, because its also attached to the CPU. The CPU makers don't want to make ten times as many SKUs as they do now, as that makes production incredibly complicated - especially if its all stacked on one substrate.
    What I could see is varying amount of memory depending on the CPU model you buy. High-end CPU comes with more memory. But if you just want more memory on a lower CPU, they might not offer that.

    I hope it doesn't come to that as being the exclusive option we face at some point in the future.
     

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