Controversy meets Progress? The great divide on Health Care in America

Pffft my protein shakes are 762 calories per shake and I take 2 on the days I train

 

Not free. Anyone who thinks public health care is free is not worthy to debate anything, in my mind.

 

Or to young to have paid any taxes yet and doesn't know any better

 

Well his DOB says 32, so I don't think that's it.

You would actually be surprised, if you talk to most people anywhere, in the US or in other countries with public health care, they usually REALLY feel like health care is free. They feel this way because they THINK that they voted the right people into office to make them rich folks pay for it all.

They don't realize their sales taxes are 10-15-20% more than in the US.

 

Don't you pay taxes already?
For what? Raods that aren't finished, schools that don't teach, poloticians that don't work, banks that make bad decisions, car companies that squandered their own money and oh yeah an army that.... well we all know about that. So what the hell is os wrong with using tax money for something that can actually help someone stay alive in your country? Too busy spending it on things that destroy lives?

 

Your attitude can disappear, or you can get out of the thread.

Given that the US has reasonable quality roads that criss cross the third-fourth largest country in the world. Given that the US has literally enough roads to go around the world almost 3 times, that comment is meaningless.

Students come from all around the world for our private schools, which is kinda ironic if you think about it.

Anyone arguing in this thread against health care would also argue against giving money to banks and car companies. I was and still am vehemently opposed to both those actions. Those companies should've been allowed to go through normal bankruptcy, and if there was no chance, put out of business.

Our defense spending has protected the world in the past and will protect it in the future. Further, I agreed with Afghanistan but not Iraq. But what is done is done. Since we destabilized the country, we had to stay and try to make it right, but that is winding down and hopefully Iraq will have a long and prosperous life afterward, though I'm not sure. Given the price on both sides, I wish Iraq had never happened. But wishing doesn't do much. But you're not on topic on this and neither am I.

 

Section 4. No oil or war.
Sprecker, follow my rules or get out of my thread.

 

This bill was long overdue. The Dems should really stop looking for Reps approval and do what is necessary. Excellent news!

 

Okay this was brought up a few times in this thread , We cant compare the Data on this because we gather the data differently than EU countries and my guess others

In the EU data they dont count miscarriages but the USA does . Thats what throwing all the data off and making it look like we have a higher infant mortality rate in all reality we dont

 

Look up paxil, suicides; and that's only one example. I, personally almost died from prescription drugs, so you're not going to convince me that they're safe, or that doctors know what they're doing when they prescribe them!

 

Look up antibiotics, Immunosuppressants, and Asthma medications.

That's really just a few. And while I've had second hand (Girlfriend) experience with the dangers of paxil, I do not believe it to be a uselessly dangerous drug. Instead, I've seen "doctors" prescribe it far too carelessly and with no thought for the patient.

But we're off topic here.

 

Are you not from here? When have the Dems EVER sought republican approval?The Democrats control (majority) the house and the senate.They do not need Republican approval to fart.
All this debate was Democrat Vs Democrat, and the people Vs their state representatives.
Our European friends mistakenly think health care is the issue- as Obama wants it.I've read over and over how a civilized country should have health care.I assure you this is not the case.Americans have health care, we have social programs to treat the poor, and we have a system in place where the poorest are treated for free.ALL FUNDED BY THE GOVERNMENT.
Make no mistake- this is war on the insurance industry, and war on profitable business.It's business as usual really; There is a private sector making money, and the government wants it's fair share.The only difference between this administration and previous ones, are they want complete control.
Again, this is not constitutional, and the greater good lies in this battle.

 

This is true. In the US, as we report our numbers, essentially any baby that comes out of the mother is a "live birth" provided it in some way moves, breathes, or has a heart beat.

In many European and Asian countries babies of less than 1-2 pounds are not counted as infant mortality and are instead reported as miscarriages and not reported.

Also, babies under a certain length are not counted in some European countries such as Switzerland.

Further:

http://www.adamsmithmd.com/2009/liv...the-trouble-with-infant-mortality-statistics/

You'll see there that because of the efforts we take (taken from the article)

If that isn't a telling statistic I don't know what is.

 

Actually the underlined R&D stuff was initially a Democrat talking point that I partially agreed with. Our choices are not Nationalize healthcare or continue paying high costs; amongst other things we could re-import drugs until a more proper solution can be devised. I don't think anyone would mind being the broker country in that process either.

As for the bolded, It was mean to be a bit childish . How many centuries do you think is necessary to rebuild? hrmm? Your argument is that you were blasted into the dirt with nothing, and that we are only more prominent than Europe because we weren't (1864 *cough*). Well if that's the only reason I'd think a century would be enough for other countries to build up, but it's not the only reason. Our methods and institutions have been modestly successful (and I do believe God really did bless us for helping in WW2). There's room for improvement but we should not scrap the whole overnight in the face of massive success. As for our size, Europe has 600 million people to our 300 (of course we already took the best ).

I should add, I find it amazing that a country who has faced annihilation by first a monarch, then by a dictator, then by communists would still support government control. Then again so did my ancestors and that's part o how we got this great country.

 

Way to go, Mr. Rogers!:banana:

 

wish Arnold Schwarzenegger would file a law suit cause this bill is going to hurt California even more then it is now.

 

In Canada, they just recently cut about 10,000 MRIs per year. Just one of many cutbacks in health and education!

 

I absolutely can not believe that my state, Georgia, would not join the other states in fighting this. Given election results in Georgia I can guarantee that, in Georgia, a majority...A large majority (read: 60% or more) do not want this nonsense and yet our attorney general refused. I've sent e-mails and done all I can do but I am confused to say the least.

 

Because my opinion doesn't agree with yours, you assume I am not from the states? What a weak argument.

What we are seeing here is a divide where people only care about themselves and no one else. Too much of my tax dollars are WASTED on defense spending and not enough on the care of civilians. Why should I have to pay for military spending?

Insurance companies have been destroying the quality of health care by denying people coverage. No coverage means that no matter how advanced medicine is, you will suffer.

We were never given a choice when the Patriot act was rushed, and I think since we have a proper public dialog we can finally get social justice. Doctors I know applaud the bill since they will fianlly be able to provide proper care without Insurance companies pulling the rugs from under patients.

The real danger, if from misleading information from Reps who have been outright lying about details in the bills. Like the mythical "Death Panels."

 

Except the damnedest thing is, we do the same thing with our insurance system. Thing is up until now we did not force people at gunpoint to join it.

underlined; I don't mind paying for *A* public education system but I don't want to pay for the schools that I attended nor would I want to attend them again. During my foray into public school I experienced regular assaults*, harassment, witnessed guns brought to school, and observed riots involving more than two hundred students in four gangs** (14 police cars had to respond to the riot, I had skipped school that day so I only witnessed the aftermath). The public schools I attended were ratholes. I eventually made it through college because I slept through that part of my schooling and read at night till 2am and because I later went to a private HS. The problems I experienced were systemic and not dealt with because of legal concerns.

No way in hell will I entrust the same government that runs those schools with the healthcare system. I hate to use subjective anecdotal experience, but it makes no sense in my mind to entrust our government with yet another vital area until they clean education up***. (At the time the schools were receiving a bit around $7,000 per year per student if memory serves)


* okay I'll admit I did deserve a right proper asskicking now and then, but not as often as I got.

**gangs in USA != gangs in Europe

*** I did attend a state run university which I mostly enjoyed, but those are managed quite differently from 'public schools'.