AMD: ZEN3 architecture finished – expects 15% faster IPC

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Nov 22, 2019.

  1. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    Yeah

    I also think this "completely new architecture" thing people keep saying and AMD keeps like throwing around is kind of nonsense. It's not a completely new architecture. Zen 1 wasn't even a completely new architecture - a ton of stuff was pulled in from Bulldozer. I feel like the tech community needs to create some kind of benchmark on how much a design needs to change to be considered a "new architecture".
     
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  2. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    Zen is a significant departure from the BD/PD arch, its much much closer to the Jaguar APU.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  3. -Tj-

    -Tj- Ancient Guru

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    So 4000 series. Guess I'll switch from intel 4000 :D


    I just want better latency.. guess it will be doable ~50us. And faster clocks. Stable 4.6 -4.7ghz across 8 cores.

    I will get 8core 16thread. Dont need more.


    The best thing would be, it would be ddr5 compatible, like some intel mobos that worked with ddr3&ddr4.


    That said, I can't wait.
     
  4. JamesSneed

    JamesSneed Ancient Guru

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    @Hilbert Hagedoorn How did you get from that statement they meant Zen3 would get 15% IPC? They certainly were talking about Zen2 and mentioned Zen3 would have a similar performance uplift but didn't mention IPC. I highly suspect a good deal of performance will be frequency from a much more mature process from TSMC. I expect 5-10% IPC with 10% clock increase in base and boost clocks.
     

  5. SniperX

    SniperX Member Guru

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    AMD twisting the knife...
     
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  6. waltc3

    waltc3 Maha Guru

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    Anyone who has used Zen/+ and Zen 2 on a regular basis knows exactly why AMD says Zen2 is a new architecture--it behaves fundamentally different--difference between an R5 1600 and a R5 3600X is night and day, and certainly the major differences are not limited to stock clocks. Zen 3 will make some major changes, imo, improvements on Zen 2 IPC of ~15% does not sound far fetched at all, and may turn out to be conservative--the difference in IPC in toto between Zen/+ and Zen 2 was more closely on the order of 30% in many cases, when all factors including cache and clocks are tallied up. I very much like it that AMD is being more conservative in its estimates these days--makes for nice surprises when the products finally ship.
     
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  7. Reddoguk

    Reddoguk Ancient Guru

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    Even if it is only 10% that'll be enough i feel to overtake Intel as the number one CPUs for gaming.

    Intel is still the leader in gaming by only a few percentage now, so any IPC increase by AMD will be a win win for AMD and us.

    I think it'll still be AM4 socket but a new chipset may be released 670X maybe.
     
  8. LEEc337

    LEEc337 Member Guru

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    If it's the same socket would previous gen Ryzen work with ddr5 and wouldn't that increase bandwidth for the bandwidth sensitive early Ryzens or is the cpu limited to ddr4 in hardware
     
  9. robintson

    robintson Guest

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    Lets hope they will lower the Latency and fix Core Scheduling performance loss which is present in Zen 2. CCX , because Windows can't use the cores to their max. potential with Zen 2 CPU's. Agree that big part of the improvements in IPC will come from the cache memory shared by all cores in Zen 3 for sure.
    First we fix the CCX design errors from Zen 2 in Zen 3 ,after we speak about the 15 % improvements in IPC in Zen 3, clear win win situation
     
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  10. heffeque

    heffeque Ancient Guru

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    I just wish they'd build a decent CPU/APU for laptops that doesn't hog battery like current ones do.

    Intel basically has 100% of the laptop market (which is not a small market at all) and even nowadays it's still difficult to recommend anything with an AMD CPU/APU.

    As for their desktop CPUs, I'm impressed by Zen 2/3... but if I had to buy anything, I'd probably wait for Zen 4, which will have 3 or 4 threads per core, and will probably bring DDR5 (couldn't care less about PCI-Express 5.0 though). If Zen 3 delivers, surely Zen 4 will be a complete beast.
     

  11. HeavyHemi

    HeavyHemi Guest

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    There's always going to be a latency penalty communicating BEWTWEEN CCX's. This is an inherent limitation of the design. You can some what mitigate via the evils such as branch prediction, you will not eliminate it.
     
  12. robintson

    robintson Guest

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    AMD has a year or two , before Intel closes the performance gap, therefore now is time for AMD to come up every year with the new CPU architecture and new CPU design. Intel has 14 nm matured vs 7 nm new process technology that AMD has, it is more than obvious who is a winner here for me
     
  13. Mpampis

    Mpampis Master Guru

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    I wish a Zen3 8core/16thread CPU would be compatible with my X370 motherboard.
    Then again, if not, Zen 3 would probably mean that I'd be able to get my hands on a 3700X on a really good price sometime in the future.
    That would bring a nice performance boost over my 1700.
     
  14. Aura89

    Aura89 Ancient Guru

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    delete
     
  15. TheDeeGee

    TheDeeGee Ancient Guru

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    Might as well hold on to my 4770K for a little longer then.
     
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  16. Kaotik

    Kaotik Guest

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    It's different enough for AMD to change processor family from 17h of Zen1/+/2 to 19h in Zen3. Granted, they've switched it once (or twice if you count going from CPU to APU) before on quite flimsy basis, but it's definitely not a habit

    So long as they can fit everything in the BIOS (which has been a challenge as we know) there's no reason it wouldn't work. Zen4 will require new socket and motherboard though (and memories to accompany, DDR5)
     
  17. Octopuss

    Octopuss Guest

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    I am still holding onto overclocked 3770K, but it's finally turned into a major pain in the ass. Lightroom just doesn't work well it at all, freezing and being slow as hell all the time and I don't know if I can keep using this PC for much longer. Zen3 definitely looks like something to wait for, but we're looking at like 7 months from now at least. I just don't know.
     
  18. NewTRUMP Order

    NewTRUMP Order Master Guru

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    Gee I just make things up ..….you got me!

    https://www.kitguru.net/components/...-gains-over-8-and-up-to-200mhz-faster-clocks/


    https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel...ase-in-clocks-compared-to-Zen-2.438940.0.html
     
  19. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    Yeah, I mean I was expecting an AMD estimate of 8% not a forum rumor. So now it's like forum rumor = 8% and then you're taking that rumor and saying it's easy to see how it could be 15%.

    It's speculation on top of speculation and the only statement we have from AMD is essentially "the 15% from Zen 2 was due to optimizations being pushed from Zen+, expect more normal numbers from Zen 3"

    Which to me means 4-6% IPC gain maybe 8 if you include the frequency bump.
     
  20. I tend to give @Hilbert Hagedoorn the benefit of the doubt given his track-record delivering accuracy. If he's wrong he's wrong and he fixes it from what I've seen... I'm looking if anyone is claiming an AMD source for any uptickwards of 15% IPC. Otherwise I agree with @Denial those are ghost estimates.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 23, 2019

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