The truth about PRE-RENDERING 0?

So if you switch your monitor to 60Hz, use full vsync, and don't use a frame capper (so you get 60FPS with vsync) you don't get these stutters?

 

Don't i need for Fast Sync more Frames do work correctly? I read somewhere that even more frames i can get, then better Fast Sync will work.

Stutters are still there like in the Graph i posted but not so aggressive like with the other Method 120Hz + 1/2. Im just wondering why the Frametimes between the Stutters are so identical...

 

The more frames your card outputs, the less input lag there is, as it simply discards the frames that are not going to be displayed, but it still renders them all of them anyway. I have used it on a 60 Hz panel with framerates lower than my refresh rate and it has worked wonderfully. It may seem if your framerate is lower than the refresh rate of your monitor it simply works as if you have Vsync on.

 

Fast sync is not useful if you cap your frame rate to almost the refresh rate. And you need to cap in order to reduce latency.

I don't know. Could be anything. Background processes, game bugs, driver issues, a gazillion other things.

 

I just registered here just to say thank you for your low latency vsync guide. Holy ****, its the first time i ever have a smooth running Dota 2 without feeling any input delay. No stutter, no tearing.

Limited my FPS to 59.990 via RTSS and used max pre rendered frames 1 and triple buffering for Dota 2 (not sure if triple buffering does anything as i read its just for OpenGL and not DX).

 

a small note on BF1. when Im using RTSS limiter, cpu usage is higher than using only in-game fps limiter and disabling RTSS limiter.

So, RTSS limiter at 0 and in-game limiter at 60, plus pre-render 2 gives me best results. in-game vsync is on btw.

 

In game frame limiters seems to have less lag than any external limiter.
RTSS is the next best option if a game offers no support for frame rate limiting.
This goes especially for G-Sync, where I found that having V-Sync set to on (via NVCPL) and in game frame limiter set slightly below max yields the best result.

 

Is there a difference between capping at [Refresh Rate]-0.007 and capping at straight 58 or 59 FPS on a 60hz monitor? I can guess capping at -0.007 gives you the most FPS while still being slightly under the refresh rate vs just being 2 FPS away from the refresh rate basically wasting ~1.9 FPS?

 

The issue is stutter. Cap to 59 or 58 and you'll see there's frame skipping.

If you don't mind the stutter, then it's fine. You can cap to whatever you want. The -0.007FPS cap is for when you don't want stutter.

 

Alright thanks. Why is it -0.007 tho? Why not 0.0014? Can you explain that from a technical point of view?

 

Accurate framerate limiters have to use a wait loop in order to ensure accurate timing. This is reflected in CPU usage which Windows then reports as 100%. Note that CPU usage is active CPU time, not CPU usage per unit of time. That is, if you're using 1% of your CPU all the time, Windows will report 100% CPU usage. But if you're using 100% of your CPU 1% of the time, Windows will report 1% CPU usage. This also explains why certain software, like Prime95, is much more stressful than other rendering applications, even though all maintain a 100% CPU usage.

Unwinder explains here:
http://forums.guru3d.com/showpost.php?p=4443926&postcount=3

 

The closer you get to the refresh rate, the more likely it is that the cap won't be reached. If the cap isn't reached, you get vsync back-pressure, which increases input lag. Vsync back-pressure is what happens if the game submits a rendered frame to the API (D3D, GL, Vulkan) and then goes ahead to render more frames. If the frame cap is actually being reached, this doesn't happen; the game will be blocked from trying to render more frames. That's what's reducing input lag; preventing the game from submitting frames to be displayed at a pace that is faster than what the monitor can keep up with.

0.007 is a small enough value to not result in stutter, but still high enough to make sure the cap is reached.

It's not a magic value, btw. 0.007, 0.008, 0.010, 0.012, all would work fine too. But you get too high, frame skipping will start to become more prominent.

 

thanks that helped a lot.

 

I've been reading this RTSS cap thing for a while and until now I've never used it.
I just set (on most games) vsync on and it's smooth and not too concerned about input lag.
But was still intrigued by this and went ahead and configured it.
With the vsynctester I found out that my monitor was 59.934 so I capped some games at 59.927.
Before this cap thing I got a frametime of 16.6ms, with this cap I also have 16.6ms so I must honestly say I can't notice if it's doing less lag then before.
It's doing a consistent 16.6ms though.
Could be my age (44), but is there something where I can see/feel this input lag? (sure when playing a game of course).
Been testing it with Fallout 4, Ghost Recon Wildlands etc.

 

Are you playing in windowed borderless mode? This trick usually only helps in exclusive fullscreen mode.

(For Fallout 4 you need to edit an ini setting to disable in-game vsync; it interferes with the cap otherwise.)

The latency difference isn't huge, but it's discernible. I have no issues ABX-ing it on 60Hz. The mouse is less "floaty". On 120Hz it's much more difficult to tell though (you get ~17ms less latency on 60Hz, but only ~8ms less on 120Hz.)

Also, it's only with a mouse where you can feel latency. If you're using a gamepad, you won't be able to tell.

 

How do you measure the frametime while gaming?

 

with afterburner in monitoring you can select it to see in osd or its own monitor screen with line chart.

 

I was playing it in exclusive full screen (all games btw) but I had the iPresentinterval on 1 (vsync). Changed it yesterday from in-game vsync to nvcpl.
Also with these RTSS settings with Ghost Recon Wildlands it's quite smooth. Whereas I sometimes had a weird random stutter, even though it was saying 60fps, it's now smoother. Responsiveness is good.
Will use this with more games, thanks!

 

Fallout 4 physics engine tend to misbehave when running at fps higher than 60.