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About Dark Souls games
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AsiJu
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Default About Dark Souls games - 01-18-2017, 23:53 | posts: 3,209 | Location: Finland

Hello gumers (that's Guru gamers, remember? )!

I've been watching some lp's of Dark Souls games and they seem interesting, in a dark, twisted way... so my way!

I've heard they are very difficult but I am looking for both a change and challenge.

So in short can the games be played independently or should they be played in order to learn the mechanics or storylinewise?
Also are newer games in the series easier or harder than previous entries?

Plus what would be your recommendation / your favourite entry in the series?

Thanks in advance!
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 00:00 | posts: 6,063 | Location: BC Canada

i played them all the stories are not really linked but they are in same universe and in some places but dont think the order matters

i have played them by myself and online
   
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Gromuhl'Djun
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Default 01-19-2017, 00:06 | posts: 5,381 | Location: Netherlands

The first souls game you play is the hardest, after that, you know the mechanics.

Start chronologically. DS1-2-3, it's the same world, but hundreds/thousands of years apart, although time gets muddy in the apocalyptic setting of the Dark Souls universe. You can recognize things from previous games if you play it chronologically. You'll miss out (a bit) if you start with 3 for example.
The "storyline" is purposely vague and open to interpretation often though. You really have to read item descriptions, pay attention to dialogue and the world to understand it.
You don't need to understand it though

My favourite is Dark Souls 1. The world is the most coherent and almost everything seems to fit (except for Lost Izalith, which doesn't seem "finished"). It's the darkest, saddest and most atmospheric entry.
Dark Souls 2 is the worst one of the series. It misses direction it seems (still pretty good game on itself). It's bright and colourful at times, which is weird. Levels don't fit together. The DLC was pretty good though.
Dark Souls 3 is good, but as I played DS1 first, it was there where the greatest challenge and sense of victory was for me. After DS1 and 2, Dark Souls 3 felt really easy. As I'm holding off playing the DLC until it's all released, I can't say what that's like.

Last edited by Gromuhl'Djun; 01-19-2017 at 00:11.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 01:03 | posts: 555

I find none of the games are overly difficult. They're mostly repetitive, with a high difficulty, but not THAT high, as many will have you believe. Dying and retrying is part of the game's mechanical design, not because the player sucks. Well, at least not to the extend some people try to make you believe.

There's a mythos of sorts around the "legendary difficulty" of the series. Don't buy into it. This game is fine for everyone who likes games, not just "pr0 l33t v1deo g4m3rz".

This is the difference between games where only you get better over time, not your in-game character, and games where the in-game character also gets better. If Dark Souls didn't have a progression system, then yes, it would be a very, very difficult game.

Note: this doesn't mean the game is easy. It just means it's not as difficult as many people make it out to be.

Last edited by RealNC; 01-19-2017 at 01:06.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 03:08 | posts: 2,822 | Location: Germany

Dark Souls 1 is best, you should start with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gromuhl'Djun View Post
My favourite is Dark Souls 1. The world is the most coherent and almost everything seems to fit (except for Lost Izalith, which doesn't seem "finished"). It's the darkest, saddest and most atmospheric entry.
Dark Souls 2 is the worst one of the series. It misses direction it seems (still pretty good game on itself). It's bright and colourful at times, which is weird. Levels don't fit together. The DLC was pretty good though.
Dark Souls 3 is good, but as I played DS1 first, it was there where the greatest challenge and sense of victory was for me. After DS1 and 2, Dark Souls 3 felt really easy. As I'm holding off playing the DLC until it's all released, I can't say what that's like.
I subscribe that.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 03:24 | posts: 1,780

They're not that hard. It might take 1-2 tries before it sticks tho. Heard lots of ppl being the same. Couldn't get into it first try, think i got to the 2nd bell and then just kinda.. meh stopped. Took a 2nd try few months later to get into it.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 07:34 | posts: 1,057 | Location: Bulgaria

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gromuhl'Djun View Post
The first souls game you play is the hardest, after that, you know the mechanics.

Start chronologically. DS1-2-3, it's the same world, but hundreds/thousands of years apart, although time gets muddy in the apocalyptic setting of the Dark Souls universe. You can recognize things from previous games if you play it chronologically. You'll miss out (a bit) if you start with 3 for example.
The "storyline" is purposely vague and open to interpretation often though. You really have to read item descriptions, pay attention to dialogue and the world to understand it.
You don't need to understand it though

My favourite is Dark Souls 1. The world is the most coherent and almost everything seems to fit (except for Lost Izalith, which doesn't seem "finished"). It's the darkest, saddest and most atmospheric entry.
Dark Souls 2 is the worst one of the series. It misses direction it seems (still pretty good game on itself). It's bright and colourful at times, which is weird. Levels don't fit together. The DLC was pretty good though.
Dark Souls 3 is good, but as I played DS1 first, it was there where the greatest challenge and sense of victory was for me. After DS1 and 2, Dark Souls 3 felt really easy. As I'm holding off playing the DLC until it's all released, I can't say what that's like.
^^Basically that.

My favorite is also the first one. The interconnected world is just amazing. Bosses, atmosphere and so on, are spot on. You do need a few MODs for it, to have the best experience DSFix, HD UI and hi-res textures. It is the most cryptic too and hard to understand, so dont be shy to look up some things, just dont spoil yourself too much. The real charm of the souls series is exploration and surprise. And if you take it slow and carefully look around, it wont be that hard. Rush it and you will have a bad time

Second one is a bit meh, but that said, it is still better than most games lol..

Third one is a bit hit and miss. I really like it, but they took a bit too much in the enemy design department from Bloodborne, and the enemies dont fit that well with the souls combat. Still a great game and the first DLC (that Im playing ATM) is also pretty cool.

And speaking of Bloodborne, if you have a PS4 it is a must have! On par with the first Dark Souls on my list, even though it is very different.

Amazing series overall and once you get it, youll love it!
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 08:03 | posts: 146 | Location: Minnesota

You should start with 1 as it has the worst controls for KB/M (even with DSFix in my opinion) and is the hardest then move onto 2 and 3. I'd personally prefer playing 1 before 3 because there's some minor references and whatnot even though each game is not linked story wise.

Dark Souls 1 has a very dreary and "dead" feeling atmosphere while 2 took a compleeeeeete different direction that made it not even seem like a Dark Souls game in a few parts and 3 attempted to mimic 1 but in its own dark way.

Also, if you do think you're not good enough to play, know that it took me 20+ tries to kill one of the first bosses in DS1 yet I managed to improve and easily finish the game and 2/3. The mechanics of the series are somewhat similar and once you learn them then they will stick with you until the end. The game is based around perseverance and rewards you greatly when you succeed.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 08:40 | posts: 1,057 | Location: Bulgaria

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scully View Post
You should start with 1 as it has the worst controls for KB/M (even with DSFix in my opinion) .....
You should, most certainly play the Souls games with a controller. Like for real
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 09:20 | posts: 3,622 | Location: England

Don't givs up once you get used too death the reward for getting through the game gratification is yours.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 10:49 | posts: 3,596 | Location: UK

Play ds1 then 3 don't waste your time with 2 even though it's a decent enough ds game it doesn't live upt o 1 and 3 imo
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 12:19 | posts: 3,209 | Location: Finland

Thanks guys for all the info and ideas!

I read a bit of reviews last night and the consensus was pretty much the same, although some said DS 3 is the best in the series.

What caught my attention is that DS 3, for a series newcomer, is perhaps a bit more accessible than previous entries, more fluent controls and more frequent bonfires.
Would you agree?

DS2 was considered the "worst" in the series (also the most punishing for newcomers) plus apparently it wasn't headed by Miyazaki so kinda figures.
Also I somewhat guessed the "legendary" difficulty of the series is just that, legend. You just need to prepare for dying and retrying a lot, finding out the right strategy for the battle.

Thinking man's melee combat game sounds right up my alley and the setting/lore is intriguing to me.

Are the entries graphically (meaning Graphics quality, not art direction) very different?
Ie does the first game look clearly dated compared to 3 even with patches?

If and when I'm gonna die and retry a lot, I want to admire the Graphics while doing it
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 12:43 | posts: 1,631 | Location: Mars

Im an huge fan of the Souls series (Demon, Dark and Bloodbourne) and like others have said the first one is the best by far and also the most difficult. The 2nd and 3rd are easier because you already know the mechanics of the game and because they are easier than the first one. Things like weapon degradation and curses that cut your health bar in half are removed from the sequels...

Also talking about the difficulty, many consider the game very hard but thats false! The game is hard specially the first time we play it because it has some "unique" gameplay mechanics and because it doesnt have health regen... After that initial learning curve, a very steep curve, the game becomes much easier but still challenging. So the first hours can be very hard to endure but are well worth it because after that the game starts to "open" and shows what an amazing game it is. The artwork is amazing and the level design is some of the best you can find in games, specially the first one. And some areas and bosses are fantastic!

Also be prepared for some disappointment after playing the first Dark Souls because both the second and the third cant match its brilliance and are (much) worse... Many consider the third to be much better than the second but i rate them at the same level... Its just they have different strenghts and weaknesses. For example the 2nd has a terrible map design and most NPCs are boring while the 3rd has the worst checkpoinsts (bonfires) ive ever seen in a game and the bosses are so bad its hard to believe!!!

Still even the worst Souls game is better than 90% of games released nowadays!...

Also dont forget to play Demon Souls and Bloodbourne!

Sorry for the wall of text but sometimes i need to tell/remember the world how amazing the Souls games are!
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 14:08 | posts: 1,057 | Location: Bulgaria

Quote:
Originally Posted by AsiJu View Post
...

Are the entries graphically (meaning Graphics quality, not art direction) very different?
Ie does the first game look clearly dated compared to 3 even with patches?

If and when I'm gonna die and retry a lot, I want to admire the Graphics while doing it
IMO with the MODs for DS1 I mentioned above, most of all the DSFix, that allows for higher resolutions (game is locked at 720/30 for some unknown reason), unlocked frame rate, better AA and SSAO, the game still looks very nice. Add to that hi-res UI and better textures and you will stop to admire the scenery I guarantee.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 15:02 | posts: 4,176 | Location: Lebanon

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scully View Post
You should start with 1 as it has the worst controls for KB/M (even with DSFix in my opinion)
How can anyone play a Dark Souls game with a mouse and keyboard?
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 15:39 | posts: 3,622 | Location: England

I played demon souls/bloodborne/dark souls all on a ps3/4 controller, it's not like a fast pace 1st person shooter like cod ect
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 16:46 | posts: 4,517 | Location: Sweden

Don't listen to ppl saying "this game isn't hard". What's easy for someone can be difficult for someone else so it's quite subjective. The base difficulty however is definitely up there so to speak.

I bought DS1 a long time ago and tried it for a few minutes but never got past the first boss which I though impossible. Much later I bought DS3 as a challenge to myself and did eventually manage to finish, though by dying countless times. The good thing about these games is that the difficulty isn't unfair or ridiculous - all you need is patience, quick reflexes and not making a single mistake.

I did try DS1 a few months ago and beat the first boss without too much trouble and the only reason I did it this time is because I had learned the mechanics (which many have said already). I never finished it though since I feel its such a clumsy game (due to its age). DS3 which has modern tech is much more fun to me plus looks way better (yes I know DS1 has DSfix and texture packs but to me it's not the same visual quality as DS3, sorry).

My personal opinion is that you try DS3 first. If I had a PS4 I'd definitely buy Bloodborne too since it seems to have the same feel as DS3 (only more fast paced). The fun thing with these games is that the difficulty level slams you in the face almost instantly. When I faced the first boss in DS3 I was this close in pressing the refund button but the feeling I got when I finally killed him was amazing and not to mention the adrenaline rush!

Last edited by Netherwind; 01-19-2017 at 16:50.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 18:01 | posts: 3,209 | Location: Finland

Quote:
Originally Posted by Netherwind View Post
Don't listen to ppl saying "this game isn't hard". What's easy for someone can be difficult for someone else so it's quite subjective. The base difficulty however is definitely up there so to speak.

I bought DS1 a long time ago and tried it for a few minutes but never got past the first boss which I though impossible. Much later I bought DS3 as a challenge to myself and did eventually manage to finish, though by dying countless times. The good thing about these games is that the difficulty isn't unfair or ridiculous - all you need is patience, quick reflexes and not making a single mistake.

I did try DS1 a few months ago and beat the first boss without too much trouble and the only reason I did it this time is because I had learned the mechanics (which many have said already). I never finished it though since I feel its such a clumsy game (due to its age). DS3 which has modern tech is much more fun to me plus looks way better (yes I know DS1 has DSfix and texture packs but to me it's not the same visual quality as DS3, sorry).

My personal opinion is that you try DS3 first. If I had a PS4 I'd definitely buy Bloodborne too since it seems to have the same feel as DS3 (only more fast paced). The fun thing with these games is that the difficulty level slams you in the face almost instantly. When I faced the first boss in DS3 I was this close in pressing the refund button but the feeling I got when I finally killed him was amazing and not to mention the adrenaline rush!
Thanks mate!

Yea sounds like DS 3 is a more accessible start for a series newbie. Plus it's on sale at CDKeys atm so. As is DS 2 but that's pretty much ruled out I guess.

DS 1 isn't available from CDKeys or other sellers I use (meaning CDKeys, SimplyGames and one similar Finnish site) and given it's also GFWL... meh. I can always buy/play it later though.
DS 3 on CDKeys is cheaper than DS 1 on Steam.

I understand why series veterans see later entries as worse but things like degrading weapons and curses on top of base difficulty... yikes!
I want a challenge, not a mental trauma

Still, anyone feel free to drop in more/different opinions! Appreciated.

I won't buy any game just yet.

Last edited by AsiJu; 01-19-2017 at 18:05.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 18:09 | posts: 93

Quote:
Originally Posted by Netherwind View Post
Don't listen to ppl saying "this game isn't hard". What's easy for someone can be difficult for someone else so it's quite subjective. The base difficulty however is definitely up there so to speak
this.

for me DS1 is the hardest game I ever played, followed by DS3.
And I've played games.

Can easily become frustrating and requires top-notch reflexes.
You screw up twice, you are dead.
You don't grasp the enemy's routines, you are dead.
You don't face bigger foes with the right stats, you are dead.

Reflexes vary a lot from person to person. A 40yo reflexes will be likely slower than those of a 15yo.

DS is one of the hardest series out there, I dare anyone to say otherwise.

One might be really good at it, there are many out there, but the game is extremely challenging. Period.

Last edited by Lurk; 01-19-2017 at 18:13.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 18:17 | posts: 418 | Location: Reality

If you buy the third to play first, you bought the wrong game. Period. Dark Souls 1 is the best by a considerable margin.
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 18:21 | posts: 5,381 | Location: Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by AsiJu View Post
Thanks mate!

DS 1 isn't available from CDKeys or other sellers I use (meaning CDKeys, SimplyGames and one similar Finnish site) and given it's also GFWL... meh.
It's not anymore though. GFWL was taken out of the game more than a year ago, and that's a very good thing

I don't know how expensive DS1 is now, but get it when it's on a steam sale.
   
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AsiJu
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Default 01-19-2017, 18:58 | posts: 3,209 | Location: Finland

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gromuhl'Djun View Post
It's not anymore though. GFWL was taken out of the game more than a year ago, and that's a very good thing

I don't know how expensive DS1 is now, but get it when it's on a steam sale.
Good to know, thanks!

Kinda torn between 1 and 3 atm... DS 1 is 30 on Steam atm (cdkeys has 3 for around 23 )
   
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Default 01-19-2017, 19:55 | posts: 418 | Location: Reality

Dark Souls 1 is less than 10 bucks on g2a
   
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Default 01-20-2017, 09:39 | posts: 1,057 | Location: Bulgaria

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Good to know, thanks!

Kinda torn between 1 and 3 atm... DS 1 is 30 on Steam atm (cdkeys has 3 for around 23 )
Yeah, on one hand DS1 is the best, on the other it is old and cryptic and confusing. So DS3 looks like a good start for a newcomer, but at the same time, as I said before, the enemies are much much faster and more aggressive. DS3 I way more linear and easy to understand, but I fear the need for faster and precise doges may be overwhelming at first.
   
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Default 01-20-2017, 13:36 | posts: 4,517 | Location: Sweden

Quote:
Originally Posted by drandiiski View Post
Yeah, on one hand DS1 is the best, on the other it is old and cryptic and confusing. So DS3 looks like a good start for a newcomer, but at the same time, as I said before, the enemies are much much faster and more aggressive. DS3 I way more linear and easy to understand, but I fear the need for faster and precise doges may be overwhelming at first.
That's a good point. DS3 is definitely more accessible for newcomers to the series than DS1 was. I really didnt understand much of DS1 when I first played it but DS3 was easier to grasp. Like I wrote before, when I play DS1 after having finished DS3 multiple times, I find it much easier to grasp the situation.
   
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