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Downsampling with AMD Crimson: Demonstration
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fr33jack
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Default Downsampling with AMD Crimson: Demonstration - 11-25-2015, 06:06 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

Hey, forum!

Long story short. With "very Crimson" release AMD has finally implemented support for custom resolutions which supposedly will allow us to create such resolutions, right. So we can create those which are greater than our monitor can support, right? And downsample it to our native resolution. Like Nvidia does for more than 10 years, right? WRONG! Either they not implemented it fully at the moment OR it's a bug (an issue) with current driver version or they simply once again flipping the bird to our faces by limiting functional. Will see.

So, you are reading this totally awesome thread, right...which means that you have faced with this little problem - you can't create higher than your native custom resolution with proper pixel clocks and timings. Radeon Settings software gives you an "Error/ FU" message...

In this Demonstration I will try to explain it & show it on my example how to archive downsampling by fool this "very Crimson" driver. But be warned! I totally would not be surprised if AMD will close this "loop" and artificially put limitation on this in next driver release. Tho lets hope that this "issue" will be resolved and for AMD not being so evil after all. Or even worse: I totally f-up and it's all working good and I was really, really wrong and confused...and I should totally kill myself cause I'm such a looser...

But be warned! They did the exac same thing with custom resolutions, by locked it down on January 2013 with 13.1 release | Downsampling with AMD: Guide and Demonstration

But first, few words...

WTF is Downsampling? Simple: Concept of rendering the image (game) at a much higher, custom made, resolution than your monitor is capable of displaying and subsequently having the GPU rescale the image to that of your monitor's native resolution. Also called OGSSAA : Ordered Grid Super Sampling Antialiasing.

WTF is DSR/ VSR? Simple: Same f-thing but with auto control and pre-made resolutions. DSR also have fancy "Gaussian filter" which "blurs" or "sharpens" downsapled image. Totally worthless tech (they totally can't fool us, grandpas, with this crap) which eats couple of FPS.

WTF This all same as CRU?! Simple: No. CRU does actual resolutions only.

From ToastyX (CRU creator): CRU adds monitor resolutions, not scaled resolutions. Lower resolutions will be scaled up if GPU scaling is enabled, but higher resolutions won't be scaled down by the GPU. Higher resolutions will only work if the monitor can handle them.

WTF is 2720 x 1530 resolution? Is it 16:9; :10? It's a 16:9 resolution. You can do the math:

1920 / 1.777777777777778 = 1080
2560 / 1.777777777777778 = 1440
2720 / 1.777777777777778 = 1530

Also, Note this:

This "Demonstration" not a total 100% manual on every "downsample" problem. I will not some kind of ultra-guru who holds every answers about it. I just the guy who uses those custom resolutions for the long time for himself. For my personal monitor with my current and previous AMD gpu's. I'm just giving you an example on how this works for me and how this was working for me for the past couple of years. So if you have something like 5 monitors and 3 CFX gpu's - Use the Force! And try (others: you too) to understand how this s*t is working by learning this s*t thought my s*ty example...and thought communicating with other guys here.

In this "Demonstration" I will show you an example with native 1080p and how to downsample to that res by creating custom resolutions: 2560 x 1440; 2720 x 1530* And with my current gpu R9 280x.

* - 2720 x 1530 is current limit for me. I can't tell for sure - maybe with HDMI or Display Port or with another monitor I can do higher. OR maybe it's an artificial limit (purposely by AMD) for all R9 280 - R5 200 series gpu's...along with 7000-5000 series and HD series. Test it for yourself and tell me =) I don't have appropriate HW to do all the testing. OFC, you will not have those limitations with monitors which can do very high resolutions by default. I'm talking about downsampling. And also, 300 series and Fury don't have those limitations at all.

So. Ok. Lets get started on foolin this very VERY Crimson driver...

I tried making it with smallest and simplest steps as possible (so it should be very easy):

PART I (in which I explain how to create first custom resolution downsapled to native; you can create up to 8k IF your gpu & monitor can handle it)

NOTE: THIS DEMONSTRATION WAS MADE WITH 1080p AS EXAMPLE. FOR MONITORS WITH 1080p AS NATIVE OR BY SPEC SUPPORTED.

NOTE: PLEASE DON'T USE EXAC SAME NUMBERS FOR YOUR MONITOR IF IT NOT SUPPORTS 1080p. YOU SHOULD REPLACE IT WITH YOUR OWN VALUES FOR YOUR DEFAULT NATIVE RESOLUTION.


1. If you are not sure about either you are or ain't f-up your driver registry by tweaking it; fool around with various settings; or any other inappropriate and shameful behavior: Uninstall the hell out of it; Use DDU @Wagnard have created it specially for you.

2. Change your desktop resolution to which you want to donwsample. Im my case - 1080p

click on image to full size


3. Open "Radeon Settings" (former CCC). Open "Display" tab; Additional settings. Change your settings as in the pic example:

click on image to full size


4. Open "Custom Resolutions" tab. Here you have "Base Mode"; "Detailed Timings" at your current desktop default. In my case - they are default for 1080p. Press "NEW"; then "VERIFY"

click on image to full size


5. This should create custom resolution same as your current desktop resolution. Press "SAVE"

click on image to full size


6. Open "System" tab back in "Radeon Settings". Check your 2D Driver path

click on image to full size


7. Open "Registry" and go to your 2D Driver path. Find your "ModeTimingOverrides" within your EDID (your name can be differ; use pic as example)

click on image to full size


8. Export your "EDID" tree...

click on image to full size


click on image to full size


9. Open previously saved .reg file. Delete highlighted strings: you will not need them.

click on image to full size


10. Now you must find hex values related to 1920; 1080; 60Hz. Easy: you will need this magic tool. It allows automated decimal to group-reversed-hex convertion.

click on image to full size


Enter field: 1920. Then push "Convert". In Column #1; 2 you will see your reversed grouped hex value. See the picture to get the idea ^^ It's very simple.

Same goes for 1080 and 60. See the pictures. Get the idea.

click on image to full size


click on image to full size


11. Now we need to change 1920 to 2560(2720); 1080 to 1440(1530) and if you monitor is overcloked - 60Hz to whatever you need.

click on image to full size


click on image to full size


12. Now you got this (see the picture). Complete reg entry with 2560 x 1440 @ 60Hz downsampled to proper 1080p (pixel clocks; timing) You can add just one OR continue to add additional resolutions...

click on image to full size


Run saved .reg file to add custom resolution. RESTART your Windows 95.

THE END OF PART I

in part II:

- 2720 x 1530 @ 60Hz as secondary custom resolution
- already created .reg entries with 2560 x 1440 @ 60Hz | 2720 x 1530 @ 60Hz ; which should work on every gpu </ = R9 280x (for 1080p LCD)
- Some other useful stuff

Last edited by fr33jack; 11-27-2015 at 09:17.
   
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fr33jack
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Default 11-25-2015, 06:07 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

PART II (in which I will show you an example of creating the secondary custom resolutions)

1. Now we will add 2720 x 1530 @ 60Hz as secondary. But first, add "comma" after last "00". Then copy selected field minus first 8 x "0" (00,00,00,00) - See the picture. Paste it after last "00,"...

click on image to full size


...you will get this (see the picture)

click on image to full size


...you will need to fix strings aliment and such (see the picture)

click on image to full size


2. Now we have .reg entries for 2 identical resolutions. Both 2560 x 1440. We need to change the one we just added to 2720 x 1530. The same way as we changed our first one 1920 x 1080 (see the pictures)

click on image to full size 2560 to 2720


click on image to full size 2560 to 2720


click on image to full size 1440 to 1530


click on image to full size 1440 to 1530


3. Now we've got this (see the picture). Complete reg entry with both 2560 x 1440 @ 60Hz | 2720 x 1530 @ 60 downsampled to proper 1080p (pixel clocks; timing) You can add multiple custom resolutions the same way as we add 1530p...

click on image to full size


click on image to full size


click on image to full size


***

THE END (for now)

- Pro tip: Use Notepad++ for editing any text files.

- Created .reg entries (txt file) with 2560 x 1440 @ 60Hz | 2720 x 1530 @ 60Hz |
WARNING! Not complete - for copy / past use only. You need your own exported .reg
WARNING! Your monitor should have 1080p as supported resolution!

click on image to DOWNLOAD reg entries


***

EASY MODE (with VSR increased limit) :

If you are 280x owner or anything in "bellow" series (R9 270-250; 7000; 6000; etc) then you are stuck atm at 2560 x 1440 on VSR (for 1080p LCD), right? Wrong. Upper limit should be at 2720 x 1530 (according to AMD-VSR data sheet it should be at 3200 x 1800 for 1920 x 1080 @ 60Hz LCD's, but WTF AMD?!)

So, lets add 2720 x 1530 via VSR (tested in latest Crimson; wasn't working for me before):

1. Open regedit. Go to your driver path. Find your DALNonStandardModesBCD1. Open it and add after 1920 x 1080 this...

click on image to DOWNLOAD reg entries


After WINDOWS 98 restart and VSR switching ON you will have those...

click on image to full size


For 3200 x 1800 limit for 290-290x's: you can try to find your actual working upper limit. Maybe 3360 x 1890 will works for you. Dunno. Don't have one. But higher resolution is better, right? So you should always try to find the way of increasing it...

***

PS. Guys, a "huge" request:
to make life easier and more comforting for the rest of us here, please post your screenshots AS "medium thumbnails" with links to original size pictures. Huge *ss pictures f-up page layouts. Horizontal scroll = not cool at all

Last edited by fr33jack; 11-30-2015 at 13:05.
   
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theoneofgod
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Default 11-25-2015, 06:11 | posts: 3,945

Thanks for the guide!

Wouldn't it be much easier to use CRU?
   
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fr33jack
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Default 11-25-2015, 06:21 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

@theoneofgod, CRU will not allow to downsample. It creates custom resolutions only.
   
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Priyeshbabariya
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Default 11-25-2015, 07:31 | posts: 27 | Location: Mumbai, India

Thanx Bro..using 1080p Res on my 900p monitor..So Very Good Crimson driver isnt crimson at all
   
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theoneofgod
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Default 11-25-2015, 07:33 | posts: 3,945

Quote:
Originally Posted by fr33jack View Post
@theoneofgod, CRU will not allow to downsample. It creates custom resolutions only.
If you add a custom resolution with CRU, say a 1920x1080 native monitor and you add 2560x1440. 2560x1440 will be available in Windows display settings and in game just like with VSR. It's the same.
   
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Default 11-25-2015, 08:50 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

@theoneofgod, it is not the same like at all. Downsampling/DSR/VSR = higher rendered resolution to your native; target display (or to whatever you wish to downsample); also called - OGSSAA; Ordered Grid Super Sampling Antialiasing.

CRU = can only do actual resolution; actual - key word

How can you know how to wrote a program at basic level as you do but don't know anything about basic tech stuff? Well...learn that s*t...cause it's basic. And you really looking stupid while sayin such things with such confidence. Remember: acting with confidence only works if you are right; if not, it's stupidity Either you and your friends-younglings trolling me purposely?

AS for now I will be not answering for obvious and very stupid questions such as "WTF is display resolution is?!"

Last advice - Google.

Last edited by fr33jack; 11-26-2015 at 13:46.
   
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Priyeshbabariya
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Default 11-25-2015, 09:09 | posts: 27 | Location: Mumbai, India

How can i use Custom Res in Desktop ...i tried it but it looks like a blury messed up so my question should be how can i apply AA in Desktop?
   
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fr33jack
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Default 11-25-2015, 09:38 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

@Priyeshbabariya, This 'demo' was made with 1080p as example. Does your monitor supports 1080p by specification? If not, you will need different values...yours: for your native resolution which your monitor supports.
   
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Priyeshbabariya
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Default 11-25-2015, 10:05 | posts: 27 | Location: Mumbai, India

Quote:
Originally Posted by fr33jack View Post
@Priyeshbabariya, This 'demo' was made with 1080p as example. Does your monitor supports 1080p by specification? If not, you will need different values...yours: for your native resolution which your monitor supports.
Hey!
My Monitor max res supported is 1600x900 @75hz
by your method i can downsample 1080p res to 900p in games as well as desktop
but in game to get rid of the blur thing because of downsample i use AA
but we dont have a option for desktop..so my question is if i use downsample res in desktop i get same blue as in game so any chance to remove it?
because i want to use downsample res in games as well as desktop
& i know the difference between CRU,VSR or Downsample.i already added 3 custom res 1920x1080 @75hz,1920x1200 @75hz & 2048x1536 @75hz by your Part-II method..thanx & Cheers!

Last edited by Priyeshbabariya; 11-25-2015 at 10:11.
   
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fr33jack
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Default 11-25-2015, 10:42 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

@Priyeshbabariya, upload some shots on some totally liberal img host...
   
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Default 11-25-2015, 10:43 | posts: 9

Thanks for this great tutorial. Just tried it and i can finally use downsampling with my old HD6870.
   
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fr33jack
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Default 11-25-2015, 10:47 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

Np,@scure.
   
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Turanis
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Default 11-25-2015, 11:00 | posts: 1,104 | Location: Into the light

You're da man. Tnx

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJHX0YLGmCI
   
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rodrigoxm49
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Default 11-25-2015, 14:18 | posts: 31

Now you're like god to me! I will pray for you every f* night.

Finally I can put 2560x1080 21:9 on my s* 1080 panel on my s* AMD graphic card!

I don't understand why people talking about AA using downsampling. Downsampling is just the best AA method that exist, there's no blurry at all! At least on the 2 monitores that I ever have tested downsampling.
   
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Default 11-25-2015, 16:05 | posts: 208 | Location: Poland

I followed the part I. I have 1920x1200 external display I only use (display nr 2) and netbook display nr 1 1024 768. After reboot when I try to set up screen resolution to 2560x1600 there is an error "Windows could not set your display to this resolution. Try a different resolution". When I change mode to 2560x1600 via advanced graphic card settings -> List all modes, the video signal goes back to laptop everytime.

After adding the reg I just made, restarting driver and adding detailed resolutions 2560x1600 using CRT, I can set it as desktop resolution and play GTA VC in 2560x1600. However if I change desktop resolution to native 1920x1200, I can't change resolution in the game - it will crash.
edit@:Seems like dx8todx9 converter v0.0018 for GTA Vice City does not like this VSR mod. I need to temporary change desktop resolution to get the same in the game.

This method seems to be lighter on resources than VSR with Omegas 14.12.

Last edited by mysteriously; 11-26-2015 at 10:50.
   
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Default 11-25-2015, 17:01 | posts: 4,409 | Location: USA

hahaha...

good read, lots of f-bombs...
   
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Default 11-25-2015, 17:23 | posts: 3,945

Quote:
Originally Posted by fr33jack View Post
@theoneofgod, it is not the same like at all. Downsampling/DSR/VSR = higher rendered resolution to your native; target display (or to whatever you with to downsample); also called - OGSSAA; Ordered Grid Super Sampling Antialiasing.

CRU = can only do actual resolution; actual - key word

How can you know how to wrote a program at basic level as you do but don't know anything about basic tech stuff? Well...learn that s*t...cause it's basic. And you really looking stupid while sayin such things with such confidence. Remember: acting with confidence only works if you are right; if not, it's stupidity Either you and your friends-younglings trolling me purposely?

AS for now I will be not answering for obvious and very stupid questions such as "WTF is display resolution is?!"

Last advice - Google.
Alright then
   
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someonelikeyou
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Thumbs up 11-25-2015, 19:37 | posts: 71

First of all thanks for posting this.

Here's how it went:
1. Did everything like you but instead of 1920 my monitor is 1280x1024 native
so I did 1280 x 1.25 = 1600 and 1024 x 1.25 = 1280

after merging the .reg file and rebooting windows would not let me change the resolution to 1600x1280 but I got a notification from the crimson panel telling me that VSR was available now. After enabling VSR now I can change to 1600x1280.

My only complain is that the letters too small and a little blurried but I guess that's to be expected. I would like a fix though, currently using 1440x1080 because it doesn't get blurry.

This brings up two questions:
- Why can't we do this through the crimson panel if it works? come on AMD
- Why the **** isn't VSR available by default for CRT displays if it works?

Again, thank you.

Pictures:
http://i.imgur.com/V9t9i2N.png
http://i.imgur.com/BEEyvRF.png
http://i.imgur.com/jPM8Sub.png

Last edited by someonelikeyou; 11-25-2015 at 19:46.
   
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The Mac
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Default 11-25-2015, 19:49 | posts: 4,409 | Location: USA

put your desktop back to native.

use the new res in games, not on the dektop.
   
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sammarbella
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Default 11-25-2015, 20:47 | posts: 3,502 | Location: Imagine...

@fr33jack

What about 3840x2160(4K) for 1080p native res monitor?

I don't need 2720X1530 having 3200x1800 from VSR.

I have HDMI, DP or DP to hdmi active.

Can it work on one of these?
   
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rodrigoxm49
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Default 11-25-2015, 21:18 | posts: 31

The tip from the other guy on Crimson topic works fine here!!!

Just choose CVT and voila!!! Works wonderful.

Anyway, thanks for this tutorial, Freejack, i'm saving here for future use!
   
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someonelikeyou
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Default 11-25-2015, 21:35 | posts: 71

Does it matter which custom resolution you set first if you're going to change it later in the .reg file? does it always have to be your native?

Got this so far: http://i.imgur.com/LKM9RI8.jpg
   
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The Mac
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Default 11-26-2015, 01:24 | posts: 4,409 | Location: USA

its supposed to be down sampling to your native res.

if you choose something else for your desktop, that becomes the final target res.

of course its going to look like ass on the desktop.
   
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fr33jack
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Default 11-26-2015, 03:11 | posts: 1,148 | Location: Moscow, Russia

@mysteriously, "Windows could not set your display to this resolution. Try a different resolution" message popups for me if I forget to uncheck "Hide modes" that this monitor cannot display". Check this, "Screen Resolution", "Advanced Settings".

@rodrigoxm49, when you choose "CVT", "CVT-Reduced", "GTF" or "DMT" it would do "auto" on pixels and timings. Some of them reduced and others increased. Totally not the proper way imo...

But there is a way to change pixels and timing manually (hex'in). Totally pain in the **s but doable. If you guys want, I can give you a picture with numbers. But I never did it for myself tho...I prefer standard 1080p pixels and timing which is working for be w/o issues.
   
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