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V-Sync Vs. Frame Limiter
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tw1st
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Default V-Sync Vs. Frame Limiter - 08-20-2013, 20:00 | posts: 147 | Location: NJ

I'm rather curious if there is a benefit over one.

I find myself limiting frames to 120FPS rather than using V-Sync in most games. It seems to cut down on some unnecessary GPU usage and has the added benefit of no input lag... or so I think anyway.

Is there really anything I would be missing out on instead of using v-sync, or is it really the same thing?
   
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Default 08-20-2013, 20:54 | posts: 1,216 | Location: Oregon

Well for one thing, by not using vsync you WILL get tearing no matter what.

And it just depends on your preferences and context.


For example when playing a MP online game, I never use Vsync, I simply limit my framerate to something reasonable depending on the game because I need the mouse response.

With CS GO though for example, Input lag is insane even at 60FPS (Digital foundry measured 106ms), I Play at 130FPS (because the game is CPU bottlenecked and even at lowest settings I can't get a consistent 200FPS even though I never remotely get full GPU usage) and still get measurable input lag.


With SP offline games though, I will usually either use Vsync + Frame limiting to 60 to ensure consistency (Some games you may notice if you use the Afterburner OSD that with vsync on the Frametime can wildly vary very quickly and the framerate will flicker back between 59 and 60. But if I frame limit to 60, the frame time is a constant 16.66ms and the framerate is almost always constant at 60)

In some other scenarios I will limit to 30FPS with vsync.
   
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CalinTM
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Default 08-20-2013, 21:26 | posts: 1,120 | Location: Timisoara, Romania

If you have a 120Hz monitor you will never need to use vsync. That monitors have no flickering at above 60fps. I cam my fps to 86, it plays smooth and i can sustain in games 80% of time 86 fps.
   
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Default 08-20-2013, 23:26 | posts: 565 | Location: Heaven

you should set it to 121 or 119 so it doesnt sync up. Also you will not get flickering at 120hz.
   
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aufkrawall2
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Default 08-21-2013, 00:28 | posts: 43

Since I got a 144Hz display, I mostly use adaptive smooth (for SLI) vsync.
Synced 60fps@60Hz is never really fluid, the more fps the better. Thus I don't really care if fps are stable or not, as long as they are high enough.
One exception is Trine 2, can't have 144fps in 1080p with 4xSSAA, so I locked it to 85Hz with Vsync.
   
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eclap
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Default 08-21-2013, 00:32 | posts: 26,181 | Location: Hampshire UK

Vsync will eliminate screen tearing.
   
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aufkrawall2
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Default 08-21-2013, 00:38 | posts: 43

With 144Hz there is just little of tearing and e.g. with a fps limit of 125 there's pretty much none at all (playing TF2 that way).
   
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Default 08-21-2013, 08:44 | posts: 307 | Location: Germany

For BF3 specifically VSync + Render Ahead 1 + Triple Buffering + FPS Limit 59 is absolutely smooth for me. The VSync + 59 Limit probably also works for other games.
   
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aufkrawall2
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Default 08-21-2013, 11:56 | posts: 43

Just as long as you don't notice the judder (which is there, no matter what).
   
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tw1st
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Default 08-21-2013, 13:40 | posts: 147 | Location: NJ

I do own a 120hz monitor (benq), so I figured rather than forcing v-sync I would just use a frame limiter and save on the input lag and gpu usage as well.

I don't really notice tearing that much honestly. Thanks for all the input guys
   
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Default 08-21-2013, 13:44 | posts: 3,756 | Location: Netherland

If you don't mind Screen Tearing cap it.

If you hate Screen Tearing use V-Sync.
   
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Default 08-22-2013, 10:20 | posts: 92 | Location: São Paulo - Brazil

Not trying to be a douche, but i just can't understand when people say that they don't mind screen tearing.

I mean, it looks like someone is cutting the image with invisible scissors every sec, ruins any immersion/smoothness and it's so blatantly obvious.

Vsync all the way, but some games do it poorly (bf3) and you have to also cap the fps.
   
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Default 08-22-2013, 10:28 | posts: 3,756 | Location: Netherland

Well since Bad Company 2 all BF Games are just poor PC ports.

And don't get me wrong, i HATE screen tearing. It's worse than Mouse Lag. Infact i don't even notice Mouse Lag anymore.
   
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Default 08-22-2013, 11:01 | posts: 565 | Location: Heaven

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadKillNL View Post
Well since Bad Company 2 all BF Games are just poor PC ports.
Amen brother. Vsync on? Seriously guys. And at 120hz if you have good hw you really shouldnt have any tearing. Maybe Iīm just blind to it but Ill look for it for a few days.

Please show stats if you have vsync on.

This is vsync off: http://bfbcs.com/stats_pc/Dolly4free Most importantly maybe are my spm and I have 114 acepins out of 220 played but my excuse its a low level char and those 15 first levels are damn hard to get acepin, but I wasnt even medic most of the time.

Last edited by Prophet; 08-22-2013 at 11:03.
   
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Crayfish
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Default 08-22-2013, 18:53 | posts: 35 | Location: Sweden

As somebody else said. Best way to go is Vsync+triple buffering+cap fsp 1 frame under refresh rate. 60hz = 59fps cap, to limit input lag.

This way you get no tearing, no typical v-sync framedrops, and low input lag.

If the game don't have built in triple buffering, just use D3Doverrider.
   
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Prophet
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Default 08-23-2013, 11:38 | posts: 565 | Location: Heaven

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crayfish View Post
As somebody else said. Best way to go is Vsync+triple buffering+cap fsp 1 frame under refresh rate. 60hz = 59fps cap, to limit input lag.

This way you get no tearing, no typical v-sync framedrops, and low input lag.

If the game don't have built in triple buffering, just use D3Doverrider.
Me, and all the best players arenīt using vsync. Just a point taking into consideration.
   
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Crayfish
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Default 08-23-2013, 12:41 | posts: 35 | Location: Sweden

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prophet View Post
Me, and all the best players arenīt using vsync. Just a point taking into consideration.
I guess you could reduce input lag even further without v-sync for hardcore gaming. But imo screen tearing is more anoying than a couple of extra ms input lag.



If you have a 120hz screen coupled with vsync and framelimit to 119fps you will probably not notice any input lag, and no tearing as well. And if your rig can handle 120fps it will be super smooth.
   
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Prophet
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Default 08-24-2013, 07:13 | posts: 565 | Location: Heaven

vsync = higher input lag. You can make it lower than 'default'. Theres really no way around it. I have 120 hz and I was playing all day y-day and didnt notice any tearing. If you have tearing, Im wondering if you really are using 120hz. You would have to check your monitors osd. If you arent noticing any input lag its probably because you are so used to vsync. There could also be a couple of other reasons for it.

Also I dont think the difference is huge in actual performance. Letīs say something around 10%. Then there difference in performance also depends on whcih game and other factor, like the combined lag of all your other devices. And game ofc. Bf3 where every bullet pretty much is as if throwing a lawnmower would probably suffer a little less from vsync and cs go where precision and speed is important and therte are ofc many really good players.
   
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Default 08-24-2013, 15:36 | posts: 423 | Location: Nicosia

just use both.. vsync + 60 fps cap (limit @ (refresh rate))
   
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tsunami231
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Default 08-26-2013, 23:21 | posts: 3,358 | Location: USA

Use vsync if tearing bothers you if it dont turn off for this "less"input lag. Either way you will get tearing if vsync is off even on those 120hz monitors it just much less apparent it still happens though

Tearing is huge eye soar to me and i have never had it off, neither have ever seen this input lag either its up to your personal preferences

Last edited by tsunami231; 08-26-2013 at 23:23.
   
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Default 08-26-2013, 23:48 | posts: 2,144 | Location: USA, Pennsylvania

I don't own a 120hz monitor, but i'm not sure how tearing would not happen without vsync.
It should be there.
   
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Radical_53
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Default 08-27-2013, 19:40 | posts: 3,081 | Location: Germany

I haven't seen much tearing with a 120Hz monitor so far, actually I can't remember seeing any.
IIRC tearing occurs when the framerate drops below the actual refresh rate after being higher than it before. Most of the games I have either stay far below 120fps all the time or they can easily be limited to a spot around 120fps (CoD for example).
   
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Default 08-27-2013, 20:02 | posts: 262

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyberdyne View Post
I don't own a 120hz monitor, but i'm not sure how tearing would not happen without vsync.
It should be there.
It happens, it's just very hard to notice to be quite honest.

For someone who couldn't play with VSync Off before, I can definitely vouch for 120/144Hz users everywhere.

It's been ~3 months since I've had this BenQ XL2411T, and playing on 144Hz is unlike anything I've experienced before, the tearing is pretty much unnoticeable/nonexistent, feels just as smooth, if not smoother vs 60Hz VSync'ed, without all the drawbacks of course (input lag, etc).
   
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Default 08-27-2013, 20:20 | posts: 325 | Location: Košice, Slovakia

I'd rather have 60Hz IPS than 120Hz TN.
   
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Cyberdyne
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Default 08-27-2013, 20:39 | posts: 2,144 | Location: USA, Pennsylvania

I'm guessing it's less noticeable for different reasons though. On a 60hz monitor, tearing is obvious below 60FPS, so it can't be that it's below 120FPS on a 120hz monitor. I think it has to do with the fact it's twice as fast, so the tearing effect only appears for half the time, and the shift in the frames (the line) would be much less shifted (half as much). At least that is as much as I surmise.
   
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