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Official Intel Haswell (K) Overclocking thread
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-Tj-
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Videocard: ZOTAC GTX780 OC AmpFan
Processor: i7 4770K OC 4.7GHz @1.28v
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Default Official Intel Haswell (K) Overclocking thread - 06-07-2013, 07:14 | posts: 8,335 | Location: Urban`Jungle

Welcome to official Intel i5/i7 Haswell series thread

Post your findings, temps, OC results, questions, etc..





Some extra info

Haswell is IVB + SB-E tweaking. iVR allows tighter regulation, so droop...pretty much gone now.

Also, L3 cache is now separate from CPU speed(was linked before), so if you got cache that runs a bit poopy, it doesn't hold the CPU back. Also, since cache utilization is never 100%, this allows you to run cache speed lower, and thereby lower temps.

Recommended L3 multi is 39-42

At the same time, it's still simple, but one more voltage is required for most 24/7 use, the ring voltage, since that's L3 and ring-bus. Since workload in cache increases with CPU speed, you need to increase ring voltage as well.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. Set XMP profile and check ram voltages, some suggest manual and stock 1333 -1600mhz at first..

1.1 If you have high memory by default 2600mhz, you might want to use lower at first (ie 2133mhz), then move to higher speeds to eliminate build-in memory controller as a potential bsod suspect.


2. keep cache (vring or uncore its one and the same thing) and its voltage at default for now


3. 4.6ghz @ 1.250v is a good start to see where you're at. Some recommend 1.20v, while keeping everything else at auto.

3.1 C-states, its ok enabled by lower volts up to ~ 1.20v, anything higher is better at auto.
C6 & C7 will cut most of cpu power and that will jump from 0.002v to 1.25v and this can sometimes cause instabilities.
C1 & C3 will act as if the core is in idle 800mhz 0.705v and then jump to 1.25v.
*This is ok.
C-state at auto (in bios, default setting) acts the same like core VID so its better to switch to balanced power plan when in idle, otherwise its pinned at 1.25v all the time.
*The least OC conflicts, but can heat more in idle.


4. For special tuning there are 4-5 things that need to be in "balance", depends on the mobo, latest asus bios 1707 fixed most of the stuff and its already in balance - all at auto, expect cpu current (110-120%) at higher OC 4.5 - 4.7ghz+.


- SVID aka input cpu voltage VCCIN 1.798v (nominal 1.80-1.85v), off at 1.69v; some may need higher 1.85 or even 1.90- 2.00v - anything over cpuv 1.3 -1.35v.

- Load Line Calibration, for adaptive/offset cpuv its recommended to use ~ 75%, in my case that LLC at 6-7 (max 8), or just leave at AUTO - seems best now with newer bios.

- cpu VRM phase control (usually its best at auto), for some fine tuning use optimized

- cpu power current, leave at auto or 110-130% (i found 120% to be the best for 4.7GHz), some mobos have this in wattage.




5. cpu Turbo long duration package limit, set to 168-250w or leave at auto - it maxes it anyway (mentioned in xbit labs guide bellow & guru3d)
Quote:
If optional, increase the TDP limit of your processor to 200~250 Watts
http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages...review,11.html
Auto


180W limit



5.1 System Voltage Agent (VCCSA) higher value can help by higher cpu & ram OC, default 0.808 - 0.816v.
* 0.005v - 0.100v+ offset is usually more then enough. 3ghz ram needs ~ 0.950v total, just to give you an idea. Its also for weaker build-in memory controller and can help by lower cpuv or higher memory OC.
I found 0.052v+ is enough for 4.7Ghz with 2400mhz ram or 0.040v+ at 4.6Ghz.

If you get BSOD 0x101 clock watchdog timeout, raise this value a bit!


- Digital IO voltage, only for ram OC, 0.005v+ offset is enough to smooth things out.
*There is a rule Analog IO needs to be 50mv lower then Digital IO, usually its ok at auto though.

- CPU build-in VR fault management - Auto or Disabled; its recommended by asus to be off or it can trip voltage when you over-volt.

- multicore enhance - Disabled; its recommended off when OC'ing.
*Depends on the motherboard.




------------------------------------------------------------------------


6. Once you found your desired OC, proceed to cache (uncore) OC, but this doesn't benefit much.. Optimal would be ~ 40-42x. For example default 39x is usually ~ 1.06v so for 41x its enough ~ 1.120v, offset or adaptive, 42x ~ 1.135 - 1.15v.

*Don't run these tests with adaptive or offset CPU voltage! Cache aka uncore isn't affected..
- Aida64 FPU
- Prime95
- IBT
- Intel tuning tool
- Linx
- OpenCL FPU

All will use higher voltage so beware when running them!!

**For example 1.23v will become 1.30v and avx2 can heat a lot. Btw no other application will heat your cpu this much, so its kinda irrelevant to test them..

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
These bellow will show instability really quick and it won't over-burn your cpu.. Actually it will show the max temperature you will ever see

- Geekbench3
- Fritz_Chees_benchmark
- Cinebench15
- x264 benchmark
- any 3dmark physics test
- Asus benchmark utility
- wprime 1024 stability test


And games/benchmarks, to stress whole system
- Resident Evil 5 dx9 mode, variable test 720p, no aa (jobthread=8 for HT)
- Lost planet2 dx9 mode, test2 720p, no aa (jobthread=8 for HT)

- Or any recent more demanding cpu game, Bf3, Bf4, Tombraider, Hitman, FarCry3, Crysis3, etc.

Most of the time its only vcore too low or cache freq. too high with not enough voltage and not enough power if using lower LLC or VRM phase/ cpu current.
But lately its best all at auto, depends on the mobo and uefi/bios version.

That's about it


จจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจจ จจจจจจจจจจจจจจจ
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Here are some extra useful links*

BSOD codes

http://www.carrona.org/bsodindx.html#0x00000124

http://www.overclock.net/t/940091/bs...must-have-info

http://www.overclock.net/t/1120291/s...-read-op-first


UEFI OC guide:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu...rclocking.html

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/I...well_OC_Guide/

http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread...untry=&status=

Tweak Guide:
http://rog.asus.com/253522013/labels...-tuning-guide/

http://rog.asus.com/254052013/maximu...-motherboards/

http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread...weakIt-Scores&


Monitoring tools:
-HWinfo64
http://www.hwinfo.com/download.php
-Realtemp TI
http://forum.techinferno.com/downloa...?do=file&id=43
-Coretemp 1.06RC x64
http://www.alcpu.com/CoreTemp/php/download.php?id=3
-Aida64
http://www.aida64.com/downloads

Last edited by -Tj-; 09-27-2014 at 14:11.
   
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8bitforlife
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Videocard: Evga 780 gtx Acx Sc
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Default 06-07-2013, 07:46 | posts: 3 | Location: Kapaa Hawaii

Getting mine tomorrow with other stuff well update in a few days. Waiting on a thread post to clear with staff on some questions also not sure how long that takes.
   
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Woodles
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Videocard: ASUS STRIX OC GTX 970 4GB
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PSU: OCZ Fatal1ty 550W
Default 06-07-2013, 08:40 | posts: 77 | Location: USA

I guess its true that its hard to hit anything over 4.3ghz without needing a stupid amount of volts unless you get a golden chip. I am stable at 1.15 volts, but 4.4ghz needs 1.25 which leads to massively more heat which I am not happy about. Don't get me started on 4.5ghz... >_> Using a h100i can't tame this beast! At 4.3ghz I only hit ~60c so thats fine for me though.

I am happy with my upgrade regardless since I have been doing much more x264 encoding. I previously had a 2500k (4.7ghz) and I didn't realize HT+AVX2 could help THAT much lol. I'll mess around more tomorrow, for now I just want to game and relax!
   
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PhazeDelta1
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PSU: EVGA SuperNOVA 1200 P2
Default 06-07-2013, 09:04 | posts: 13,769 | Location: USA

Be careful when you delid:

   
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lucidus
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Default 06-07-2013, 09:07 | posts: 7,066 | Location: Dubai

^^ Elaborate pls
   
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PhazeDelta1
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Default 06-07-2013, 09:10 | posts: 13,769 | Location: USA

Quote:
Originally Posted by lucidus View Post
^^ Elaborate pls
Just be careful of the resisters when you go sticking that razor blade in. I already about someone bricking their 4770k because they nicked off 2 of the resistors .
   
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-Tj-
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Videocard: ZOTAC GTX780 OC AmpFan
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Soundcard: Creative X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: Chieftec NTRO88+ 650W
Default 06-07-2013, 09:26 | posts: 8,335 | Location: Urban`Jungle

The biggest issue that cripples OC and raises temp is if you put L3 right bus at the same multiplier like cpu

ie cpu multi 45 and L3 multi 45.

Recommended L3 multi is 39-41.


Quote:
Quote:
4.4GHz/1.22v (as far as I went).
Did you adjust ring voltage when you clocked the multi up? set 1.150, 39 multi for ring, THEN clock up CPU.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PhazeDelta1 View Post
Just be careful of the resisters when you go sticking that razor blade in. I already about someone bricking their 4770k because they nicked off 2 of the resistors .
Wood + Vice method with a hammer is safer, but I wouldnt want to try any of it, looks scary on a 300€ chip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg9ybeB4DDw

Last edited by -Tj-; 06-07-2013 at 09:36.
   
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Svarog
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Default 06-07-2013, 09:43 | posts: 3,839 | Location: The Netherlands

I'm alrdy running into the USB 3.0 Bug without using Sleep Mode.

My Corsair Flash Voyager 64GB USB 3.0 get's randomly disconnected from USB 3.0.

Not happy about that at all.
   
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-Tj-
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Soundcard: Creative X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: Chieftec NTRO88+ 650W
Default 06-07-2013, 09:48 | posts: 8,335 | Location: Urban`Jungle

^
Maybe Gigabyte needs bios update?

Try their support ticket and let them know about it
http://www.gigabyte.com/support-down...l-support.aspx
   
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Darren Hodgson
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Videocard: EVGA NVIDIA GTX 980 SC
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Memory: 16GB Corsair Veng 1600MHz
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PSU: XFX PRO Black Ed. 850W
Default 06-07-2013, 09:51 | posts: 12,209 | Location: England

I should get mine tomorrow, although I'm undecided whether I rebuild my PC over the weekend or not. I may leave it until next week.

I do not intend overclocking my CPU initially as it already runs at 3.5 GHz at stock and with the optimizations and whatnot over the older i7-920, it'll run as fast, if not faster, than that chip which I had overclocked to 3.7 GHz. I'm only using an air cooler, Noctua NH-D14, so when I do overclock it will be to something conservative like 4.0 or 4.2 GHz.

I saw a YouTube video review of the i7-4770K overclocked to 4.6 GHz running on water-cooling and, although it was only using 1.2 V, the temps were hitting 89-94 C across all four cores during an OCCT test!!! Ouch! And in the same video, it was showing the card running at 3.7 GHz on an idle desktop using a voltage of... wait for it... 0.2 V! That's not a typo... that's 0.2 V, not 1.2! Apparently the power-saving features of this CPU are remarkable; it's just a shame they get extra hot once you start overclocking them but given the small size, 22nm, then it is unavoidable. Larger chips are easier to keep cool but they obviously require more power to run them.

I'm looking forward to playing around with my i7-4770K... I'm not, however, looking forward to having to rebuild my PC at all...
   
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PhazeDelta1
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Default 06-07-2013, 09:57 | posts: 13,769 | Location: USA

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Tj- View Post


Wood + Vice method with a hammer is safer, but I wouldnt want to try any of it, looks scary on a 300€ chip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg9ybeB4DDw
I've seen that before. That would actually be the best way to delid.
   
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Svarog
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Videocard: Zotac GTX 680 4GB
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PSU: Seasonic Platinum 760
Default 06-07-2013, 10:00 | posts: 3,839 | Location: The Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Tj- View Post
^
Maybe Gigabyte needs bios update?

Try their support ticket and let them know about it
http://www.gigabyte.com/support-down...l-support.aspx
Just send the ticket, i hope they will figure it out.
   
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Dusty_M
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Default 06-07-2013, 10:43 | posts: 55 | Location: Germany

I'm just waiting for the cooler to be in stock at the retailer. I phoned them today and they told me it would arive today. So there is a possibility that they ship my stuff today.
   
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Darren Hodgson
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Videocard: EVGA NVIDIA GTX 980 SC
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Mainboard: ASUS Z87 Deluxe v2103
Memory: 16GB Corsair Veng 1600MHz
Soundcard: SB X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: XFX PRO Black Ed. 850W
Default 06-07-2013, 11:02 | posts: 12,209 | Location: England

I have a few questions about my new build that I'd appreciate someone helping me with:

1. The CPU comes with on-board graphics, which will be my first experience with such a chip, but when turning the PC on for the first time to configure the BIOS/UEFI should my display be connected to my NVIDIA graphics card or the on-board HD4600? It might sound like an obvious question so forgive me if it is. I don't want to be confronted with a black screen, simply because I plugged my HDMI cable into the wrong port!

2. Relating to question 1 but should I fit my NVIDIA GTX 780 later after I've configured the BIOS etc and checked the machine boots? I guess that would answer where to plug my HDMI into!

3. Is the BIOS/UEFI accessed in the same as with a traditional BIOS, i.e. by pressing DEL on the keyboard during POST?

4. Although, I will want to initially run by CPU at stock speeds to ensure everything is running fine and the cooler is working properly, what is a very easy and safe overclock for the 4770K, that doesn't require any voltage tweaking at all? I understand that this unlocked CPU is overclocked merely by raising its multiplier in the BIOS and there's no having to worry about how raising the BCLK will affect memory speed etc like I had with my i7-920.

5. What temp is considered risky for this CPU? I saw a review which mentioned throttling occuring at 85 C so presumably I should be making sure my CPU always runs well below that at all times? I've seen some forum comments where people have expressed concern at their Intel CPUs hitting 65 C, is that really considered 'dangerous' for these chips?

Thanks.

P.S. Scan have sent my stuff so roll on tomorrow...

Last edited by Darren Hodgson; 06-07-2013 at 11:04.
   
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thatguy91
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Default 06-07-2013, 11:13 | posts: 4,156 | Location: Australia

The bios is entered the same way with UEFI as with legacy (old style) bios. The only time this isn't the case is if you selected Ultra-fast boot mode.

With a discrete card installed, it will be the default. This can be changed in the bios.

If you install Windows the normal way, it will install in legacy mode. If you want to install Windows in UEFI mode, you have to make sure the boot device (SSD ) is initialised as GPT, not MBR. You then have to make sure you enter Windows setup in UEFI mode, not legacy boot mode.

Basically, you can distinguish a UEFI and legacy boot system straight away by how it boots. A legacy boot system will have the Windows boot logo stuff, and UEFI boot will have your bios logo (in your case Asus) right through until Windows is loaded.

DDR3-2133 would have been a better choice
   
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Svarog
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Videocard: Zotac GTX 680 4GB
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Memory: 8GB G.Skill ARES 2133 MHz
Soundcard: SoundBlaster ZxR
PSU: Seasonic Platinum 760
Default 06-07-2013, 11:19 | posts: 3,839 | Location: The Netherlands

So far my CPU at Stock doesn't go past 50C in gaming sessions. And that's with the NH-U14S sucking air from the back of the Videocard (Only way i could orentatie it)

Later today i'm gonna do some underclocking, run some OCCT for 30 min every time and see what i need as a Stock Voltage. Then go from there.
   
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-Tj-
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Videocard: ZOTAC GTX780 OC AmpFan
Processor: i7 4770K OC 4.7GHz @1.28v
Mainboard: ASUS Z87 Deluxe
Memory: Crucial BLE 16GB 2400MHz
Soundcard: Creative X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: Chieftec NTRO88+ 650W
Default 06-07-2013, 12:01 | posts: 8,335 | Location: Urban`Jungle

@ Darren

no5

It will start to throttle at 100C, imo max safe with a stress app something like OCCT or Linx would be 80-85C.

Check my 1st post for some extra info, there is no real guide yet, but to have "temperature under control" keep ring bus L3 cache at max 41 multi. Also dont go crazy with voltage 1.3v max..


@RoadKill

One more thing, Are you at win8? If you are you can try this; plugin that usbkey and go to devies, here right-click on that usb key and select troubleshoot, maybe it will resolve this issue.
   
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Svarog
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Videocard: Zotac GTX 680 4GB
Processor: Intel Core 4770K
Mainboard: Gigabyte Z87X-UD5H
Memory: 8GB G.Skill ARES 2133 MHz
Soundcard: SoundBlaster ZxR
PSU: Seasonic Platinum 760
Default 06-07-2013, 12:05 | posts: 3,839 | Location: The Netherlands

I'm on Windows 7.

It disappears when transfering files. After like 30 seconds.
   
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-Tj-
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Videocard: ZOTAC GTX780 OC AmpFan
Processor: i7 4770K OC 4.7GHz @1.28v
Mainboard: ASUS Z87 Deluxe
Memory: Crucial BLE 16GB 2400MHz
Soundcard: Creative X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: Chieftec NTRO88+ 650W
Default 06-07-2013, 12:07 | posts: 8,335 | Location: Urban`Jungle

I think win7 has the same troubleshooting procedure, worth a try.
   
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Darren Hodgson
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Videocard: EVGA NVIDIA GTX 980 SC
Processor: Intel Core i7-4770K
Mainboard: ASUS Z87 Deluxe v2103
Memory: 16GB Corsair Veng 1600MHz
Soundcard: SB X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: XFX PRO Black Ed. 850W
Default 06-07-2013, 12:14 | posts: 12,209 | Location: England

Quote:
Originally Posted by thatguy91 View Post
If you install Windows the normal way, it will install in legacy mode. If you want to install Windows in UEFI mode, you have to make sure the boot device (SSD ) is initialised as GPT, not MBR. You then have to make sure you enter Windows setup in UEFI mode, not legacy boot mode.
I'm afraid I don't quite understand this.

Are you saying that if you install Windows as MBR then it will not give me access to the UEFI? Sorry for being so naive but I have no experience with the new BIOS or GPT at all.

My plan was to back up my current Windows 8 install using Acronis True Image 2013 Plus Pack, as I do every month actually, and then use its Universal Restore feature to restore it onto to my SSD with the new hardware. The Universal Restore feature allows you to recover a Windows backup onto a system with different hardware to the one it was backed up on. The reason I want to try this is to avoid the need to reinstall all of my games and apps again. I don't mind reinstalling/updating drivers as that doesn't take that long in comparison.

It may not work at all or I might find that I have issues after recovering it this way. However, I want to try it first. Would I need to recover this as a GPT then rather than MBR (I do recall seeing both options in the Acronis Loader, which I have on some USB memory sticks in case I cannot get into Windows)? I guess I need to do a little research before putting together my new build.

Quote:
DDR3-2133 would have been a better choice
Why? My system is primarily for games and the benchmarks I've seen comparing 1,600 MHz vs. 2,400 MHz memory on the i7-3770K show little or no difference in the majority of the games that were tested. Since you can overclock the CPU without it affecting other components, including the memory, then I didn't see any real point in spending more for faster memory that would have little or no tangible benefit to me. It seems the sweet spot for memory speeds is 1,600 MHz from what I've been reading and above 1,866 MHz you see less and less improvement.

Maybe faster memory would have been useful if I was doing lots of video editing, compression and other non-gaming tasks but I don't do any of those things. Memory is relatively cheap anyway so I can always upgrade it later if I need to.

Last edited by Darren Hodgson; 06-07-2013 at 12:19.
   
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Svarog
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Videocard: Zotac GTX 680 4GB
Processor: Intel Core 4770K
Mainboard: Gigabyte Z87X-UD5H
Memory: 8GB G.Skill ARES 2133 MHz
Soundcard: SoundBlaster ZxR
PSU: Seasonic Platinum 760
Default 06-07-2013, 12:20 | posts: 3,839 | Location: The Netherlands

I just went to Device Manager after it disappeared, but there is nothing to troubleshout. It says the device is working correctly.
   
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Darren Hodgson
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Videocard: EVGA NVIDIA GTX 980 SC
Processor: Intel Core i7-4770K
Mainboard: ASUS Z87 Deluxe v2103
Memory: 16GB Corsair Veng 1600MHz
Soundcard: SB X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: XFX PRO Black Ed. 850W
Default 06-07-2013, 12:50 | posts: 12,209 | Location: England

@ RoadKillNL - Have I made an error in ordering the Noctua NH-D14 cooler for my i7-4770K instead of the NH-U14S you have? It seems mine is an older model. What are the differences between the one I'm getting and the one you have?

*EDIT*
Which way should the fan be mounted in my HAF 932 case, which has two roof fans and a side fan as well as the usual front intake and rear exhaust fans? Should I be blowing air up through the roof or out of the rear of my case?

*EDIT 2*
Ah, I found this review: http://www.vortez.net/articles_pages..._review,1.html

Seems I'll at least be OK if the fans both die on mine...

Last edited by Darren Hodgson; 06-07-2013 at 12:57.
   
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BLEH!
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Videocard: 7970 CF @ 1050/1500
Processor: 980X @ 4.00 GHz
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PSU: Enermax Revo 1500W
Default 06-07-2013, 12:53 | posts: 4,956 | Location: London

Oooh, can you OC the Uncore like Nehalem?
   
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Svarog
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Default 06-07-2013, 12:59 | posts: 3,839 | Location: The Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren Hodgson View Post
@ RoadKillNL - Have I made an error in ordering the Noctua NH-D14 cooler for my i7-4770K instead of the NH-U14S you have? It seems mine is an older model. What are the differences between the one I'm getting and the one you have?

*EDIT*
Which way should the fan be mounted in my HAF 932 case, which has two roof fans and a side fan as well as the usual front intake and rear exhaust fans? Should I be blowing air up through the roof or out of the rear of my case?
The design is the same, it's a tower cooler, but it has only 1 tower unlike the D14.

I watched Hilberts review of the U14S vs D14 and there wasn't a huge difference. This might also be because the U14S comes with the new 2013 Fans unlike the D14. So that's why i decided to get the U14S in the end.
   
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Darren Hodgson
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Videocard: EVGA NVIDIA GTX 980 SC
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PSU: XFX PRO Black Ed. 850W
Default 06-07-2013, 13:06 | posts: 12,209 | Location: England

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadKillNL View Post
The design is the same, it's a tower cooler, but it has only 1 tower unlike the D14.

I watched Hilberts review of the U14S vs D14 and there wasn't a huge difference. This might also be because the U14S comes with the new 2013 Fans unlike the D14. So that's why i decided to get the U14S in the end.
Thanks for replying. Yeah, I'm just reading the Guru3D review now. I wish I'd done a bit more research on the cooler first before ordering as the U14S looks thinner and doesn't impede the area where the memory is as much as the D14 does. I have ordered low profile Corsair Vengeance memory anyway but if I need to change it, say, if I want faster RAM or more of it then I'd have to remove the cooler to do it.
   
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