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120hz vs. 144hz
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stojo
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Default 120hz vs. 144hz - 05-05-2013, 01:06 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

Hello,

first sorry for my bad english. I am from Germany.
I have a question:

I have the Benq 2420 120hz monitor and it is doing a good job.
Colours are bad, but okay, it is a tn panel.
But it is a huge positive different vs 60hz monitors in response time and smoothness.

So i read the last days many articles and discussions about the Asus vg248qe 144hz monitor.

In most reviews it has a response time of 1ms gtg.
But i want to know, if someone tested the 144hz vs. 120hz monitor.
I mean, yes, 60 to 120 hz is a great step in smoothness.
But how is it about 120 to 144 hz?
Anybody tested it yet and can tell me something about it?
Could i see or feel the different? Or is it just a commercial gag?

I almost play FPS games and love the 120hz.
Now i am thinking about to buy the Asus with 144hz.

Many thanks in advance.

stojo
   
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harkinsteven
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Default 05-05-2013, 01:22 | posts: 2,269 | Location: Ireland

If you want the next big step in smoothness then get a lightboost 2 monitor. You can force the lightboost tech to work in 2d games and it completely eliminates motion blur and input lag. I have the Benq XL2411T and while it can do 144hz, 120hz with lightboost on is much much better. Check out Blurbusters.com for more information and supported monitors.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 02:13 | posts: 9,163 | Location: Toledo

Quote:
Originally Posted by harkinsteven View Post
If you want the next big step in smoothness then get a lightboost 2 monitor. You can force the lightboost tech to work in 2d games and it completely eliminates motion blur and input lag. I have the Benq XL2411T and while it can do 144hz, 120hz with lightboost on is much much better. Check out Blurbusters.com for more information and supported monitors.
The BenQ XL2411T is using the *exact* same panel as the Asus VG248QE. I have the Asus, which is cheaper and more common in North America. The BenQ is cheaper and more common in Europe (In fact, you can't even really get one here).

With that said, the earlier BenQ 120hz monitors aren't very good and there's a *noticable* difference upgrading to the newer panel. The 144Hz mode doesn't really add much, but as harkinsteven said, the 2D Lightboost support does.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 09:59 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

Thank you guys.
I read about lightboost in other forums. It is great to hear that with lightboost you can notice a difference.
Ordered the asus now. Anybody got a good link with instructions for lightboost for newbies like me?
And is the image quality really so bad with lightboost on, like many people say?
   
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IcE
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Default 05-05-2013, 12:33 | posts: 9,163 | Location: Toledo

http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 13:16 | posts: 2,269 | Location: Ireland

Quote:
Originally Posted by stojo View Post
Thank you guys.
I read about lightboost in other forums. It is great to hear that with lightboost you can notice a difference.
Ordered the asus now. Anybody got a good link with instructions for lightboost for newbies like me?
And is the image quality really so bad with lightboost on, like many people say?
There is no difference in image quality with it on or off. The benq has a slight red hue which is easily removed with Windows colour calibration.
Which forcing lightboost on Id recommend option B to have light boost on permanently rather than just games.

Last edited by harkinsteven; 05-05-2013 at 13:18.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 14:56 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

Ah okay.
Iīm gonna test it. The Asus comes tomorrow
Hope i can handle it with the instructions.

I thought there is a difference in brightness with this lightboost.
But if it is all the same, itīs perfect.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 16:34 | posts: 2,269 | Location: Ireland

Quote:
Originally Posted by stojo View Post
Ah okay.
Iīm gonna test it. The Asus comes tomorrow
Hope i can handle it with the instructions.

I thought there is a difference in brightness with this lightboost.
But if it is all the same, itīs perfect.
There is a difference in brightness but not image quality. Not bad with the BenQ as it is extremely bright monitor even at low brightness settings. As far as I know the Asus lacks brightness.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 17:04 | posts: 649 | Location: W.A.K.T

I would say 144hz is more trouble than it's worth, and if you play with VSYNC that's gonna be a painful experience.

once you get to 85hz+ things are strong, 120 is as good as it needs to get, 144hz is a scam.

However like with many things, once you get into the realm of 'high end' like with HDTV your not likely to get a high end TV without 3D whether you want it or not.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 17:43 | posts: 9,163 | Location: Toledo

Quote:
Originally Posted by harkinsteven View Post
There is a difference in brightness but not image quality. Not bad with the BenQ as it is extremely bright monitor even at low brightness settings. As far as I know the Asus lacks brightness.
It doesn't, mine is still as bright as the sun at 50%. As I said, same exact panel, just a different electronic interface and OSD.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StealBalls View Post
I would say 144hz is more trouble than it's worth, and if you play with VSYNC that's gonna be a painful experience.

once you get to 85hz+ things are strong, 120 is as good as it needs to get, 144hz is a scam.

However like with many things, once you get into the realm of 'high end' like with HDTV your not likely to get a high end TV without 3D whether you want it or not.
Lol, it's hardly a scam. It's not like you're paying a huge premium for that feature alone. Not to mention there *is* a difference, albeit pretty minor and one that requires old games or some heavy hardware to truly push. I personally run mine in 120Hz mode just because I'm fine with that.

With that said, in the OP's case it's still probably worth changing over, considering this panel in particular is far superior to the older 120Hz panels, especially considering the Lightboost support.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 18:38 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

I have another question.
I read on BlurBusters Homepage that my Benq2420 ist supported for that lightboost trick too.
Is it right? I mean, i thought the Asus has the advantage with lightboost.
So if i can do lightboost on my 2420, is buying the Asus worth it?
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 18:45 | posts: 9,163 | Location: Toledo

Quote:
Originally Posted by stojo View Post
I have another question.
I read on BlurBusters Homepage that my Benq2420 ist supported for that lightboost trick too.
Is it right? I mean, i thought the Asus has the advantage with lightboost.
So if i can do lightboost on my 2420, is buying the Asus worth it?
Hmm, I thought it was one of the ones that didn't. In that case, you'll have to test the Asus side by side yourself and decide if it's worth it to you or not. Otherwise, just return it.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 18:52 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

http://www.blurbusters.com/zero-motion-blur/lightboost/

Supported Monitors: ASUS VG248QE, BENQ XL2411T, ASUS VG278H, ASUS VG278HE, BENQ XL2420T, BENQ XL2420TX, BENQ XL2720T, Acer HN274HB.

So okay. Going to test the Lightboost this evening and compare it to the Asus tomorrow. But, if the Lightboost ist going to impress me now on my Benq, i will send the Asus back immediately.

Like i said, i am fine with hardware. But never did any experiments on monitors like lightboost.

And i donīt think, if the lightboost trick works good on my Benq, that it will work better on the Asus.
   
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stojo
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Default 05-05-2013, 21:53 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

Okay i am testing lightboost right now.
I handled the instructions for my Benq 2420. It feels a little bit like 60 hz, smooth but light noticable flickering. Perhaps it is placebo. The games are running fine with no blur. Like in CRT times.
But the brightness is too dark for me. It makes the whole image looks worse.
Donīt know if i want to play all the games with lightboost. I mean games are more pretty for me without it.
So waiting to get the Asus tomorrow and compare these two monitors with and without ligthboost on.


Update:

This lightboost hack is no option for me.
I canīt live with this dark image. Feels like lower hz to me.
Sure, Blur is gone and the resposne time feels like in good old crt times.
Going to test the Asus without the lightboost hack.
Just compare 144hz vs 120hz and image quality.

Last edited by stojo; 05-05-2013 at 22:45.
   
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harkinsteven
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Default 05-05-2013, 23:04 | posts: 2,269 | Location: Ireland

Quote:
Originally Posted by stojo View Post
Okay i am testing lightboost right now.
I handled the instructions for my Benq 2420. It feels a little bit like 60 hz, smooth but light noticable flickering. Perhaps it is placebo. The games are running fine with no blur. Like in CRT times.
But the brightness is too dark for me. It makes the whole image looks worse.
Donīt know if i want to play all the games with lightboost. I mean games are more pretty for me without it.
So waiting to get the Asus tomorrow and compare these two monitors with and without ligthboost on.


Update:

This lightboost hack is no option for me.
I canīt live with this dark image. Feels like lower hz to me.
Sure, Blur is gone and the resposne time feels like in good old crt times.
Going to test the Asus without the lightboost hack.
Just compare 144hz vs 120hz and image quality.
It probably feels like that because its a strobe light. Did you try turning the light boost up in the monitor settings? Also play with the contrast settings? I have no brightness issues with this XL2411T and as IcE has said that the Asus and Benq share the same panels so there should be no difference.
   
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Default 05-05-2013, 23:33 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

When lightboost was enabled, all options except contrast were greyed out. I couldnīt change anything.
Putting up the contrast was okay. But far away from an image i could live with.

I notice 60 vs 120hz. It was like a big step, a revolution. But with this lightboost i didnīt notice that much. No ghosting and a little better response, but no big step.

Perhaps it could be better, if i could handle with the colours. But like i said, everything was greyed out.
Canīt believe that someone can live with that quality. I mean every tn panel has poor image quality. But this lightboost gave me the rest.
   
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Default 05-06-2013, 11:19 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

Ok got my Asus vg248qe today.
My question was, if there is a difference vs my Benq xl2420 because of the 144hz of the Asus.

And the answer is: yes. The faster response time of the Asus, in combination with the 144hz give me a smoother feeling. This is no placebo.
Only problem now is calibrating the image quality of the Asus. Didnīt find good settings yet.

But one thing is for sure. I am going to keep this Asus und sell my Benq.
   
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Default 05-06-2013, 16:11 | posts: 9,163 | Location: Toledo

Quote:
Originally Posted by stojo View Post
Ok got my Asus vg248qe today.
My question was, if there is a difference vs my Benq xl2420 because of the 144hz of the Asus.

And the answer is: yes. The faster response time of the Asus, in combination with the 144hz give me a smoother feeling. This is no placebo.
Only problem now is calibrating the image quality of the Asus. Didnīt find good settings yet.

But one thing is for sure. I am going to keep this Asus und sell my Benq.
Yep. I was trying to say that earlier. As for the settings, use these:

Splendid= Theater Mode
Sharpness= 40 (eliminates some minor fringing on text – also use ClearType)

Brightness= 54 (according to preferences and lighting)

Contrast= 43 (default contrast in this preset gives major shade crushing)

Color Temp= User Mode

Red= 100

Green= 95

Blue= 93
   
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Default 05-06-2013, 16:25 | posts: 3,310 | Location: Lebanon

Quote:
Originally Posted by IcE View Post
Yep. I was trying to say that earlier. As for the settings, use these:

Splendid= Theater Mode
Sharpness= 40 (eliminates some minor fringing on text – also use ClearType)

Brightness= 54 (according to preferences and lighting)

Contrast= 43 (default contrast in this preset gives major shade crushing)

Color Temp= User Mode

Red= 100

Green= 95

Blue= 93
Every monitor is unique. Your settings might not work for his monitor. It might make it better if the tint was a common occurrence, but it might also make it worse.
   
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stojo
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Default 05-06-2013, 16:36 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

Thank you guys. I will test the settings after work. I know that Monitors of the same Model could be different. But i will give it a try.
Now the image runs in Standard mode and it looks washed out.
   
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Default 05-06-2013, 17:52 | posts: 2,269 | Location: Ireland

Use digital vibrance in nvidia control panel to add some color back.
   
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stojo
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Default 05-06-2013, 18:52 | posts: 62 | Location: Germany

Will test settings from ice and try digital vibrance after work. Can not wait to get home.
   
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Default 05-06-2013, 19:18 | posts: 26,663 | Location: Hampshire, UK

Also on tn panels reducing gamma is worth checking out (in driver cp)
   
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Default 05-06-2013, 19:40 | posts: 9,163 | Location: Toledo

Quote:
Originally Posted by yasamoka View Post
Every monitor is unique. Your settings might not work for his monitor. It might make it better if the tint was a common occurrence, but it might also make it worse.
They might not, but it's worth a try, which is why I posted.
   
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Default 05-06-2013, 20:36 | posts: 2,038 | Location: NOVA

Quote:
Originally Posted by stojo View Post
Hello,

first sorry for my bad english. I am from Germany.
I have a question:

I have the Benq 2420 120hz monitor and it is doing a good job.
Colours are bad, but okay, it is a tn panel.
But it is a huge positive different vs 60hz monitors in response time and smoothness.

So i read the last days many articles and discussions about the Asus vg248qe 144hz monitor.

In most reviews it has a response time of 1ms gtg.
But i want to know, if someone tested the 144hz vs. 120hz monitor.
I mean, yes, 60 to 120 hz is a great step in smoothness.
But how is it about 120 to 144 hz?
Anybody tested it yet and can tell me something about it?
Could i see or feel the different? Or is it just a commercial gag?

I almost play FPS games and love the 120hz.
Now i am thinking about to buy the Asus with 144hz.

Many thanks in advance.

stojo

When 120hz TN was the only option, I purchased the 120hz vg278h.

Since then, people started "overclocking" high rez IPS displays to ~120+ hz.
(135 ish hz was ~max in ideal conditions)

Asus then changed the firmware in their 120hz displays to allow 144hz, basically allowing their displays to report a higher clocked resolution as being available by default.

You can still take the earlier 120hz variants of asus displays, and add a custom resolution in your control panel to take the displays up to 144 hz, as it's just another "overclock".






I've used a number of refresh rates, even above 240hz (CRT @ 1024x768 and under).
I can tell you that the differences are tangible, but the benefits tend to be logarithmic.

Assuming you're in an FPS where you quick turn a lot:

60 to 75 is noticeable, but not extreme.
60 to 85 is easy to feel.
60 to 120 is extremely easy to feel.
60 to 150 is extremely easy to feel.
60 to 240 is 'holy crap it feels smooth even when flinging my mouse left/right like mad'.

120 to 150 is noticeable, but not too meaningful.
120 to 240 is extremely easy to feel. It really is eerily smooth.

I used to care a lot when I was playing a lot of quake, and mine and my computer's performance was 'a big deal' to me.

Today, TBH, I'd rather have the high rez 120hz IPS display, enjoy the better colors and 1440p, and just accept the few milliseconds of pixel latency.

Also, games with very static camera angles hardly matter.

-scheherazade
   
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