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Samsung Galaxy S4 Announced Ships in April
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Hilbert Hagedoorn
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Default Samsung Galaxy S4 Announced Ships in April - 03-15-2013, 07:25 | posts: 20,999 | Location: Guru3D testlab

Samsung has announced the Galaxy S4. Revealed at tonight's Unpacked event in New York City, the Galaxy S4 will take the mantle of the Galaxy S III as Samsung's new flagship smartphone, sporting a ma...

Samsung Galaxy S4 Announced Ships in April
   
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kanej2007
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Default 03-15-2013, 07:38 | posts: 6,801 | Location: Dubai, UAE / London, UK

Looks identical to the Note II, awesome spec nevertheless!
   
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Speed Weed
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Default 03-15-2013, 08:29 | posts: 1,025 | Location: Somewhere in Scotland

Managed to survive an hour of that streaming rubbish from Times Square very late last night/early this morning.
Really painful to watch.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 09:17 | posts: 5,503 | Location: Switzerland

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed Weed View Post
Managed to survive an hour of that streaming rubbish from Times Square very late last night/early this morning.
Really painful to watch.
I had cut the sound and just watch the "text" of the specifications when it was coming,

Last edited by Lane; 03-15-2013 at 10:01.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 09:24 | posts: 791 | Location: RO TM

I don't know way you did it, is better to wait for some real reviews , hoping Hilbert will do one to !
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 09:26 | posts: 11,362 | Location: England

The new Sony phone looks much better.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 09:48 | posts: 6,432 | Location: Chilling

Galaxy 3S

Seriously, there is nothing here for the most part that can't be backported to the Galaxy S3 or that apps can't do for any modern android phone. The field is wide open for Motorola and Google with their "X-phone" and Apple to finally make a new modern interface and continue to take the lead. Absolutely no one I talked to was anymore excited for the S4 than they were for the S3.

That being said, props to Samsung for the replaceable battery and Micro-SD.

In addition, that was the corniest presentation I have perhaps ever watched, it was almost painful. No one wonder why Anand just cut his liveblog short; I would have also just done a hands on and left when I saw that show.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 10:05 | posts: 6,432 | Location: Chilling

One of the things I also can't understand is why the rear camera can't record at 60 FPS, the hardware is certainly powerful enough...
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 11:30 | posts: 26,153 | Location: Hampshire UK

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chillin View Post
Galaxy 3S

Seriously, there is nothing here for the most part that can't be backported to the Galaxy S3 or that apps can't do for any modern android phone. The field is wide open for Motorola and Google with their "X-phone" and Apple to finally make a new modern interface and continue to take the lead. Absolutely no one I talked to was anymore excited for the S4 than they were for the S3.

That being said, props to Samsung for the replaceable battery and Micro-SD.

In addition, that was the corniest presentation I have perhaps ever watched, it was almost painful. No one wonder why Anand just cut his liveblog short; I would have also just done a hands on and left when I saw that show.
well, the presentation was mainly about new Samsung software. I don't care about that, I'll get rid of that bloatware on day one. I'll be buying the s4 for it's impressive spec, not the Samsung software. you can't reproduce that on the s3 or any other phone atm.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 11:36 | posts: 7,078 | Location: Above Earth in a Big Rocket Ship

The conference was terrible, they basically said nothing about the hardware. US variant is getting the S600, which at this point I think is better than the octacore, especially considering the A15's are clocked at 1.2ghz.

The LTE version isn't shipping till later this year too, so who knows when that is. At the point I think I'll end up getting something else.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 11:42 | posts: 7,470 | Location: The Netherlands

And.. It is still made of plastic.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 11:56 | posts: 7,078 | Location: Above Earth in a Big Rocket Ship

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinnie View Post
And.. It is still made of plastic.
I prefer the plastic as long as it's well constructed and isn't the slippery garbage that is the back of the S3.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 18:59 | posts: 1,268 | Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Just because it looks like a S3, doesn't mean it would run like one. Expected better from all the posts here considering this a tech site. Exynos 5 Octa vs a Snapdragon S4, 1080p 441ppi vs 720p 306 ppi, the specs are pretty impressive.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 19:17 | posts: 7,078 | Location: Above Earth in a Big Rocket Ship

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vxheous View Post
Just because it looks like a S3, doesn't mean it would run like one. Expected better from all the posts here considering this a tech site. Exynos 5 Octa vs a Snapdragon S4, 1080p 441ppi vs 720p 306 ppi, the specs are pretty impressive.
I think most people know/knew the specs were going to be improved. It basically brings the S3 up to par with current generation phones. There is nothing really special about the hardware. A15's at 1.2Ghz probably will come in at around what Krait cores perform at anyway.

The biggest complaints about the S3 were the button layout, aesthetic and the interface. Samsung did absolutely nothing to remedy any of that, despite the fact that the korean guy got up on stage and said like 15 times that they designed the phone around consumer feedback. Last time I checked no one wanted to play 7 songs synced at the same time.

Last edited by Denial; 03-15-2013 at 19:20.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 21:08 | posts: 19,054 | Location: Toronto, Canada

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denial View Post
I think most people know/knew the specs were going to be improved. It basically brings the S3 up to par with current generation phones. There is nothing really special about the hardware. A15's at 1.2Ghz probably will come in at around what Krait cores perform at anyway.

The biggest complaints about the S3 were the button layout, aesthetic and the interface. Samsung did absolutely nothing to remedy any of that, despite the fact that the korean guy got up on stage and said like 15 times that they designed the phone around consumer feedback. Last time I checked no one wanted to play 7 songs synced at the same time.
Ummm, the Cortex A15s run at 1.6 GHz and the Cortex A7s run at 1.2 GHz in the same chip for the Exynos 5 Octa. It runs in the big.LITTLE configuration that ARM designed. Honestly, I'm more impressed by the big.LITTLE design than Qualcomm's design. The Cortex A7 kicks in for most tasks like browsing, texting and video playback, and then the Cortex A15 will kick in when absolute performance is required, say when you're gaming. Personally, i don't understand why Samsung opted to put 4 Cortex A7 cores since programs that will trigger the Cortex A7 wouldn't need 4 cores, a dual core Cortex A7 would make more sense but I guess Exynos 5 Hexa wouldn't sound as sexy as the Exynos 5 Octa. When either the A7 or A15 is on, the other is powered down, so it'll help save battery. Qualcomm doesn't have a similar design. Even NVIDIA's Tegra architecture has a similar design (Tegra 4 relies on all A15s but the companion core is built on a different process than the rest of the performance cores).

Plus, pure clock speed doesn't really make much difference since the experience is still smooth, hell, I underclocked my Nexus 4 as I really didn't see a performance hit, yet I got a lot more out of its battery life.

deltatux

Last edited by deltatux; 03-15-2013 at 21:10.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 21:09 | posts: 6,432 | Location: Chilling

Here is the first official benchmark of the Exynos 5 version:

http://youtu.be/zPaIA16VqQI


Numbers are decent, but it looks like the Snapdragon 600 will blow past this easily. I wonder how the Adreno 320 stacks up to the 544MP3.
   
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Chillin
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Default 03-15-2013, 21:13 | posts: 6,432 | Location: Chilling

Quote:
Originally Posted by deltatux View Post
Ummm, the Cortex A15s run at 1.6 GHz and the Cortex A7s run at 1.2 GHz in the same chip for the Exynos 5 Octa. It runs in the big.LITTLE configuration that ARM designed. Honestly, I'm more impressed by the big.LITTLE design than Qualcomm's design.

Plus, pure clock speed doesn't really make much difference since the experience is still smooth, hell, I underclocked my Nexus 4 as I really didn't see a performance hit, yet I got a lot more out of its battery life.

deltatux
It is not yet certain what runs at what. Anand said that he heard that the A15 is at 1.2:
https://twitter.com/anandshimpi/stat...61491095498752

Either way, it looks like the Snapdragon 600 phones are faster anyways based on the benchmarks. The GPU parts might be a different story though.

And I'm not sure how practical it is cost wise and silicon wise to have such a complicated setup as big.little rather than four efficient cores that can clock independently of each other (Snapdragon, etc). It must take up no small amount of space on the die.
   
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Denial
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Default 03-15-2013, 21:28 | posts: 7,078 | Location: Above Earth in a Big Rocket Ship

Quote:
Originally Posted by deltatux View Post
Ummm, the Cortex A15s run at 1.6 GHz and the Cortex A7s run at 1.2 GHz in the same chip for the Exynos 5 Octa. It runs in the big.LITTLE configuration that ARM designed. Honestly, I'm more impressed by the big.LITTLE design than Qualcomm's design. The Cortex A7 kicks in for most tasks like browsing, texting and video playback, and then the Cortex A15 will kick in when absolute performance is required, say when you're gaming. Personally, i don't understand why Samsung opted to put 4 Cortex A7 cores since programs that will trigger the Cortex A7 wouldn't need 4 cores, a dual core Cortex A7 would make more sense but I guess Exynos 5 Hexa wouldn't sound as sexy as the Exynos 5 Octa. When either the A7 or A15 is on, the other is powered down, so it'll help save battery. Qualcomm doesn't have a similar design. Even NVIDIA's Tegra architecture has a similar design (Tegra 4 relies on all A15s but the companion core is built on a different process than the rest of the performance cores).

Plus, pure clock speed doesn't really make much difference since the experience is still smooth, hell, I underclocked my Nexus 4 as I really didn't see a performance hit, yet I got a lot more out of its battery life.

deltatux
Couple things here. Number one Quad A7's are necessary because you are going to be using them a lot. At MWC Samsung showed a demo and pretty much the 4 A7's were used at 100% power, essentially 85% of the time. As for big.little, my problem is that it's only going to benefit use cases where you're racing to sleep. You fire up those A15's at 1.6Ghz and you're immediately going to 4-6w TDP, in which a game would drain the battery in probably close to 2 hours. Second, Samsung doesn't own an ARM architectural license. So they couldn't modify ARM's big.little design for 2 A7's anyway.

As for Samsungs implementation, according to anandtech they chose to run the A7's at 1.6Ghz since they are used often and the A15's at 1.2 to save power. So basically they reversed it. At full A15 load, the processor should cap at 2w which is far more reasonable for a phone.

So basically you're getting A15's which run at Krait performance anyway. I'd honestly rather have the better GPU in the A600 + integrated LTE than the Octacore any day of the week.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 21:44 | posts: 19,054 | Location: Toronto, Canada

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denial View Post
Couple things here. Number one Quad A7's are necessary because you are going to be using them a lot. At MWC Samsung showed a demo and pretty much the 4 A7's were used at 100% power, essentially 85% of the time. As for big.little, my problem is that it's only going to benefit use cases where you're racing to sleep. You fire up those A15's at 1.6Ghz and you're immediately going to 4-6w TDP, in which a game would drain the battery in probably close to 2 hours. Second, Samsung doesn't own an ARM architectural license. So they couldn't modify ARM's big.little design for 2 A7's anyway.

As for Samsungs implementation, according to anandtech they chose to run the A7's at 1.6Ghz since they are used often and the A15's at 1.2 to save power. So basically they reversed it. At full A15 load, the processor should cap at 2w which is far more reasonable for a phone.

So basically you're getting A15's which run at Krait performance anyway. I'd honestly rather have the better GPU in the A600 + integrated LTE than the Octacore any day of the week.
The Qualcomm Snapdragon 600 doesn't come with integrated LTE, it's an APQ, not an MSM SKU. It'll be like the Nexus 4 where it'll require an external baseband radio to work.

As for the licensing, ARM do have dual core A7 designs, Samsung just chose to use quad core A7 designs instead, Samsung, being the manufacturer can choose how they implement their ARM cores even though they don't have the ARM ISA license.

I read differently and that the A15s will run at 1.6 GHz and A7s will run at 1.2 GHz. Even Anandtech say so as well, not sure where you got your clockspeeds from...: http://anandtech.com/show/6768/samsu...er-at-isscc-13

As for when the A15 gets fired up, not everyone uses their phones to game (I don't use my phone for gaming for instance), so for most people, they'll mainly be using the Cortex A7 and then only fire up the A15s whenever they do game or do other types of processing that will trigger the A15s (like computationally heavy applications like postprocessing effects or image processing). We'll have to see actual benchmark to see how well Samsung's implementation of ARM's big.LITTLE design to see how it compares to NVIDIA's Tegra design and Qualcomm's traditional SoC design.

deltatux

Last edited by deltatux; 03-15-2013 at 21:48.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 21:59 | posts: 6,432 | Location: Chilling

Speed wise, the A15 used in the Exynos 5 seems to be a tad slower than the Krait 300 in the Snapdragon 600. But the GPU in the Exynos 5 (544MP3, 51.2 GFLOPS looks to be much faster than the one in the Snapdragon 600 (Adreno 320, ~30-35 GFLOPS).
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 22:03 | posts: 7,078 | Location: Above Earth in a Big Rocket Ship

Quote:
Originally Posted by deltatux View Post
The Qualcomm Snapdragon 600 doesn't come with integrated LTE, it's an APQ, not an MSM SKU. It'll be like the Nexus 4 where it'll require an external baseband radio to work.

As for the licensing, ARM do have dual core A7 designs, Samsung just chose to use quad core A7 designs instead, Samsung, being the manufacturer can choose how they implement their ARM cores even though they don't have the ARM ISA license.

I read differently and that the A15s will run at 1.6 GHz and A7s will run at 1.2 GHz. Even Anandtech say so as well, not sure where you got your clockspeeds from...: http://anandtech.com/show/6768/samsu...er-at-isscc-13

As for when the A15 gets fired up, not everyone uses their phones to game (I don't use my phone for gaming for instance), so for most people, they'll mainly be using the Cortex A7 and then only fire up the A15s whenever they do game or do other types of processing that will trigger the A15s (like computationally heavy applications like postprocessing effects or image processing). We'll have to see actual benchmark to see how well Samsung's implementation of ARM's big.LITTLE design to see how it compares to NVIDIA's Tegra design and Qualcomm's traditional SoC design.

deltatux
Yeah you're right about the 600 and LTE, it's the 800 that supports LTE onboard, I thought it was both.

As for the A7 you might be right, not sure -- I remember an anandtech podcast mentioning why they wouldn't/couldn't go for less -- I tried looking it up and couldn't find it. Either way I think Quad A7's are fine due to how often they are used.

As for clock speeds:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6832/s...ction-hands-on

Quote:
The Exynos 5 Octa side is a bit more interesting. Samsung is calling the SoC a 1.6GHz Octa-core part, but that appears to be the clock speed for the four Cortex A7 cores. The four Cortex A15 cores will run at up to 1.2GHz, which should help keep power consumption manageable. We’ve been wondering for a while what clock speeds we’d see the Cortex A15s run at in smartphones, and I believe this is the first line drawn in the sand. If we go back to Samsung’s ISSCC disclosure of Exynos 5 Octa power consumption, it looks like peak CPU power consumption should be somewhere around 2W - definitely better than what we saw from Exynos 5 Dual in the Nexus 10. Again, no surprises here given that we’re talking about a smartphone - it’s just interesting to see.
Also coming from an opensource fanboy I would have thought you would support the S600 considering samsungs track record for Exynos support :p

I'd still rather have the snapdragon I think.

Last edited by Denial; 03-15-2013 at 22:05.
   
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Default 03-15-2013, 22:09 | posts: 6,432 | Location: Chilling

To be honest, I would rather have the new Atom core that's due for the end of this year. Alas, I must "suffer" with my S4 Pro, such first world problems.
   
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Default 03-16-2013, 04:06 | posts: 19,054 | Location: Toronto, Canada

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denial View Post
Yeah you're right about the 600 and LTE, it's the 800 that supports LTE onboard, I thought it was both.

As for the A7 you might be right, not sure -- I remember an anandtech podcast mentioning why they wouldn't/couldn't go for less -- I tried looking it up and couldn't find it. Either way I think Quad A7's are fine due to how often they are used.

As for clock speeds:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6832/s...ction-hands-on



Also coming from an opensource fanboy I would have thought you would support the S600 considering samsungs track record for Exynos support :p

I'd still rather have the snapdragon I think.
To be honest, I would like to see more diversity in SoC design, I do commend Qualcomm for their open source track reecord, but the Exynos team isn't too shabby. What I don't like is that Qualcomm is using its dominance in CDMA technology (that's why they have so much money, they're the Intel of the ARM architectural family) to dominate the SoC market. I would love to see Samsung use their own SoC or even another competitor like NVIDIA or ST-Ericsson for their flagship phones.

Plus, I really like the big.LITTLE design philosophy. Though of course I would also want the manufacturers to help champion open source.

Honestly, I can't really think of a reason why the North American S4 release are the only ones using Qualcomm's SoC except that probably the American carriers want the Qualcomm SoC due to probable backdoor negotiations since Qualcomm built most of the tech which Verizon and Sprint uses for their CDMA networks.

deltatux

Last edited by deltatux; 03-16-2013 at 04:09.
   
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Default 03-16-2013, 14:26 | posts: 6,432 | Location: Chilling

OK, I decided to run the same tests on the Nexus 4 (stock firmware, latest update) as this guy ran on the Galaxy S4. Here are the results:

Quadrant:
Nexus 4: 4927
Galaxy S4: 11782

CPU:10416
CPU:39190

Memory: 7419
Memory: 9662

IO: 4156
IO: 7338

2D: 340
2D: 500

3D: 2303
3D: 2220 (What the heck!?)

Last edited by Chillin; 03-16-2013 at 14:32.
   
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Denial
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Default 03-16-2013, 14:30 | posts: 7,078 | Location: Above Earth in a Big Rocket Ship

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chillin View Post
OK, I decided to run the same tests on the Nexus 4 as this guy ran on the Galaxy S4. Here are the results:

Quadrant:
Nexus 4: 4927
Galaxy S4: 11782

CPU:10416
CPU:39190

Memory: 7419
Memory: 9662

IO: 4156
IO: 7338

2D: 340
2D: 500

3D: 2303
3D: 2220 (What the heck!?)
The Adreno 320 is good man.
   
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