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suggestions on too-low 2d voltage/clocks/whatever...
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  (#1)
scheherazade
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: (.) an
Processor: sb-e water
Mainboard: p9x79 ws
Memory: 32 gig
Soundcard: spdif 4x12" driver towers
PSU: dual 1000w
Default suggestions on too-low 2d voltage/clocks/whatever... - 04-24-2012, 10:30 | posts: 2,038 | Location: NOVA

So, I am having 'issues' with my 680.

Basically, it TDRs like crazy. Every 10 seconds a TDR, and it's hard-locked within a minute.
(tried all the 300+ series drivers available at the time of this post.)

I had issues with some 570's earlier, so after having issues with the new 680 I decided it has to be my system and not the card.

I did a clean format, fresh install, and loaded everything but the video drivers - saved a drive image.

I used the system without video drivers for a while, and it was issue-free.

I then installed a video driver (301.25) and rebooted.
Right after the reboot I was hit with TDR after TDR again.


I tried a few tricks that had helped with the 570...

One of which was "set power from adaptive to performance".
That didn't seem to help.

I then tried bumping my voltage in afterburner.
+100 mv helped a bit, but still every few minutes it would TDR.
Can't go any higher anyways... so that's not a fix.

I then ran fur-mark to force the GPU into 3D clocks.
Success - zero TDRs. (I don't even need the manual voltage bump)

Turns out that so long as I run something 3D at all times, I have no TDRs.
I can leave fur-mark up, or anything else. So long as the card bumps up to 3D settings it works.

So, my dilemma... what to do?
AFAIK I can't force the card to '3D clocks all the time'...

And even if I could, the driver TDRs during boot half the time - before any program would have a chance to change the default video bios settings.

I also don't want to blanket-OC the card (if that's even a valid approach). It's 3D performance is good enough as-is for what I use it for.




I still wonder about my system, since I had to do similar things to get my 570's to behave...
But wth could cause this?



Note :
I also swapped PSU's to a different 1000w supply (before the format). No change.
All my 1000w supplies measured 12.05v while in use (+/- 0.01v between units).

-scheherazade

Last edited by scheherazade; 04-24-2012 at 10:37.
   
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Mufflore
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Videocard: KFA2 Anarchy 580@930/4650
Processor: 2500K @ 4.5GHz - blew it!
Mainboard: Gigabyte P67 UD4 B3
Memory: 8G Kngston 2.2GHz CL11 1T
Soundcard: Minimax+ & Dexa Opamps !!
PSU: Corsair Pro AX750
Default 04-24-2012, 11:46 | posts: 9,769 | Location: UK

Reset the CMOS.

Test the PC with only the gfx card and hard drive plugged in.
No USB devices other than keyboard/mouse.

If it fails that and you cant test it in another PC, send it back.
   
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smashly
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: 2x GTX 560ti / GTX 670
Processor: i7 2700k / i5 3570k
Mainboard: Asus Gene-Z / GA Z77MX
Memory: G.Skill 8GB Ripjaw / Ares
Soundcard: Onboard
PSU: Enermax 1000w / 1020w
Default 04-24-2012, 12:47 | posts: 989 | Location: Australia

Just guessing, but have you tried with less memory in a different slot config.

Going from what your saying the problem almost sounds like it's carried on over from your 570 cards.
So if you've eliminated the PSU you might want to check your mobo/ram.

When I did a quick google search for "p9x79 ws problem" I did see a couple of hits with the different video cards but the same problem as your describing.
Some people reported that the problem stopped by using different ram slots or in the case of max slots used they tried with less ram in different slot combinations and the video card stopped responding problem ceased...
In most cases when running the max amount of memory and running memory tests and they received no errors.
So it sort of sounds like an unresolved mobo/bios issue with certain configs.
It's not an answer, but maybe worth a shot to try playing with the memory (eg: less memory in different slot combinations).

Good luck

Last edited by smashly; 04-24-2012 at 13:01.
   
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scheherazade
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: (.) an
Processor: sb-e water
Mainboard: p9x79 ws
Memory: 32 gig
Soundcard: spdif 4x12" driver towers
PSU: dual 1000w
Default 04-24-2012, 19:02 | posts: 2,038 | Location: NOVA

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mufflore View Post
Reset the CMOS.

Test the PC with only the gfx card and hard drive plugged in.
No USB devices other than keyboard/mouse.

If it fails that and you cant test it in another PC, send it back.
Yeah, I'm in that process now.

I updated the bios to the latest and cleared it.

USB wise, this motherboard is annoying.
You almost have to have the kb/mouse by itself on boot because the onboard hub won't power much before it shuts down peripherals.
If you have a boot menu, and you got a joystick/throttle/pedals/etc plugged into usb, you won't be able to select your boot option because the keyboard will power down.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smashly View Post
Just guessing, but have you tried with less memory in a different slot config.

Going from what your saying the problem almost sounds like it's carried on over from your 570 cards.
So if you've eliminated the PSU you might want to check your mobo/ram.

When I did a quick google search for "p9x79 ws problem" I did see a couple of hits with the different video cards but the same problem as your describing.
Some people reported that the problem stopped by using different ram slots or in the case of max slots used they tried with less ram in different slot combinations and the video card stopped responding problem ceased...
In most cases when running the max amount of memory and running memory tests and they received no errors.
So it sort of sounds like an unresolved mobo/bios issue with certain configs.
It's not an answer, but maybe worth a shot to try playing with the memory (eg: less memory in different slot combinations).

Good luck

Funny thing about that...

This same issue that I had with the 570's, it started on an x58 system.
I built the x79 system in part to just get away from all the x58's parts.
So it's a totally new build, with the same issue, carrying over the 570's.

And of the 6 570's that I RMA'd (570 sli, so 2 cards per cycle), I managed to get 1 single 570 that didn't suffer any issues.
I can plug in the '1 good 570' (single card setup) and go about my business with no problems.
I can plug in any of the other 570's that I've gone through (single card setup) and the problems start.





I also did a search for my mobo (eg. p9x79 tdr, p9x79 ws tdr, p9x79 ws problem, p9x79 ws problem tdr) but I haven't had much luck finding the specific problem.

I have found plenty of other systems with this specific problem.


This guy had a bad stick of ram :
http://www.overclockers.com/forums/s...d.php?t=701779

I've ran memtest for 24 hours with no issues.
Note that I also have my ram down clocked from 1866 to 1600 for added headroom.



This guy has my exact issue, but it's on a P67 system :
http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m...e=1&print=true

And he fixed it in a similar way to me ... pump up the 2D clocks (analog to running it at 3D clocks).




There are older threads that relate more to the general nvidia TDR issue :
~1300 posts : http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=215256
~200 posts : http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=223716
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?s...c=216187&st=20
http://hardforum.com/archive/index.php/t-1668021.html

But I already knew about those.

There's issues where switching power states would cause a card to TDR, or in combination with flash hardware acceleration or firefox hardware acceleration.

But those are usually fixed with selecting "performance" under the nv power management, and by turning off flash/firefox hw accel.
Or by rolling back to a driver in the 275.5- range.

In any case, those "fixes" don't work in my case.
Only pumping up the clocks gets my stuff sorted.




There's a bunch of x79 talk here :
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1653127&page=7

But most pertains to booting and ram issues - which I have none.
There is a guy in there too that needs to leave stuff running to not TDR, but no info on resolution.




Do you have any links to p9x79 ws with my specific problem? I'm having trouble finding any.




I'm gonna see if I can raise my pci-e voltage a tad...




And I'll play around with using 1 stick of ram.

Which would be nice if that was the 'issue', since bumping the memory controller voltage (which you do to fully populate in some systems) is easy.
I did it with my x58, which would not OC when fully populated without the bump.

But these things make me think the ram is fine :
-using the x79 system for a few hours on a 680 without a video driver - no problems encountered
-using the x79 system for a long long while with a particular 570 - no problems encountered
-24 hour error-free memtest

So I'm not holding out hope for that test.



I'm tired of RMA's, in any case.
Maybe I'll just change the 2D clocks in the bios and call it a day...







Amusingly, my "run something 3D" work-around has been very reliable.
In 2D clocks, I TDR every few seconds. It's difficult to even navigate.
The TDRs have stopped immediately on launching furmark (switches to 3D clocks).
And the TDRs resumed immediately on stopping furmark (switches to 2D clocks).

With furmark running continuously, the TDRs have been gone.
Half a day of furmark and half a day of no TDRs.
Not a single gorram problem - so long as furmark is up.

I can play games, watch videos, use flash, or sit in desktop doing 'nothing', etc, everything is happy in 3D clocks...

-scheherazade

Last edited by scheherazade; 04-24-2012 at 19:37.
   
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  (#5)
smashly
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: 2x GTX 560ti / GTX 670
Processor: i7 2700k / i5 3570k
Mainboard: Asus Gene-Z / GA Z77MX
Memory: G.Skill 8GB Ripjaw / Ares
Soundcard: Onboard
PSU: Enermax 1000w / 1020w
Default 04-25-2012, 02:48 | posts: 989 | Location: Australia

Hi,
Not much to go on in the thread but first short thread I read (first and last post seemed to have a similar but not quite the same issue): http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/30...eo-card-issues

Like you most other threads I looked at didn't pertain to the exact scenario your having.
Most were bitching about the bios, not being able to install windows, usb problems, pcie 3.0 problems with Xfire 7970s, etc..
   
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scheherazade
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: (.) an
Processor: sb-e water
Mainboard: p9x79 ws
Memory: 32 gig
Soundcard: spdif 4x12" driver towers
PSU: dual 1000w
Default 04-25-2012, 03:37 | posts: 2,038 | Location: NOVA

Update :

18 hours of no TDR events while running furmark.

Stopped furmark, 20 seconds later TDR.
10 seconds after that 'green screen of death'.

Back to running furmark...

-scheherazade
   
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smashly
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: 2x GTX 560ti / GTX 670
Processor: i7 2700k / i5 3570k
Mainboard: Asus Gene-Z / GA Z77MX
Memory: G.Skill 8GB Ripjaw / Ares
Soundcard: Onboard
PSU: Enermax 1000w / 1020w
Default 04-25-2012, 03:53 | posts: 989 | Location: Australia

You could also use GPU-Z to hold it in 3D mode.
Little question mark beside the PCIE Bus Interface -> Start Render Test.

At this rate like you'll be doing a bios edit on your card.
Have you tried your card in another PC?
   
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scheherazade
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: (.) an
Processor: sb-e water
Mainboard: p9x79 ws
Memory: 32 gig
Soundcard: spdif 4x12" driver towers
PSU: dual 1000w
Default 04-25-2012, 08:28 | posts: 2,038 | Location: NOVA

Played with ram, and voltages for VTT, VCCSA, etc. Various combinations from 1.10 to 1.30.
Problem persists.

Tried setting the GPU minimum voltage to match the 3D voltage using asus gpu tweak.
Problem persists. (crazy)

Tried running a single display.
Problem persists.

Tried using only 60hz.
Problem persists.

Tried using GPU-Z's 'Render Test' as a furmark substitute.
Problem persists.



At times it seemed to get better, which made me think that I was on to something...
But then it would wig out again.

To date, the only reliable fix is to run furmark non stop.



Baffled...



Unfortunately, the only other systems I have to test with are both x58, and use the same motherboard.
And they both had similar issues with various 570's... So they're not a solid alternative.

(Granted my x58 + 570 system had far less aggravated TDRs... it was enough to turn off hardware acceleration in flash and firefox to make it usable. The x79 + 680 system is far worse, and will TDR in an empty desktop in no time flat.)




edit

Messing around with ram more.
I had some weird settings in my bios last time I pulled the sticks (from messing with a voltage fix), because now with default bios and 1 stick it isn't TDRing (also, my controller card is out...)

I'll walk it in from here and see what I have to add to make the issue come out again.
I hope it's the controller card, because that's the cheap/easy fix.




edit

Mixxed results.

I added more ram in stages, and got back to 8 dimms and still no TDRs.
So I thought it had to be the controller card.
Then after 10+ mins of 'normal' use I got anther TDR. No controller card. 8 dimms.
(I thought it was fixed, since it's never taken that long before...)

So I went back to messing with the voltages, but nothing worked.
I then went back and set all voltages to auto.
I then turned off all power saving states except the bare minimum (I left turbo and enhanced speed step enabled), and raised all the current limits, and bumped up all the LLC's up one notch from default.
So far so good... Still evaluating, but no TDRs in the last few minutes.


edit

Still no issues... looking good.

I've had a cool 20+ hard locks during this debugging, and not a scrap of lost data.
Feeling much safer/better about my SSDs, particularly the intel 320 since it's in-use during all the hard locks.


edit

About 6 hours now and no TDRs.
I've replaced the controller card, and will see if it makes it through another batch of hours.

-scheherazade

Last edited by scheherazade; 04-25-2012 at 18:39.
   
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scheherazade
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: (.) an
Processor: sb-e water
Mainboard: p9x79 ws
Memory: 32 gig
Soundcard: spdif 4x12" driver towers
PSU: dual 1000w
Default 04-26-2012, 04:21 | posts: 2,038 | Location: NOVA

Still no TDRs.


Here are my bios settings right now :

Note :
[Most likely] Not all these will be needed. I just haven't bothered to go through all the permutations to narrow it down to just the minimum amount.



OPTIMIZED DEFAULTS

+

CPU LLC = medium
CPU Current Capability = 130%

VCCSA LLC = high
VCCSA Current Capability = 130%

DRAM Channels AB Current Capability = 130%
DRAM Channels CD Current Capability = 130%

Intel Adaptive Thermal Monitor = off

CPU C1E = Disabled
CPU C3 = Disabled
CPU C6 = Disabled
CPU C7 = Disabled

VRM = current (NOT T.probe)

-scheherazade

Last edited by scheherazade; 04-26-2012 at 04:25.
   
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  (#10)
smashly
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: 2x GTX 560ti / GTX 670
Processor: i7 2700k / i5 3570k
Mainboard: Asus Gene-Z / GA Z77MX
Memory: G.Skill 8GB Ripjaw / Ares
Soundcard: Onboard
PSU: Enermax 1000w / 1020w
Default 04-26-2012, 06:42 | posts: 989 | Location: Australia

Good to hear you got it sorted. (fingers crossed)
Nothing worse then when your plug 'n' play hardware seems more like plug 'n' pray.

When looking at the specs on your mobo I can see why you bought it, the specs look nice.
Hope it holds up for you and you get a consistant run of use with it from here on.

Good luck
Cheers.
   
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