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  (#26)
anxious_f0x
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Default 05-30-2017, 14:02 | posts: 1,084 | Location: England

1080Ti is somewhat overkill at 1080p 60fps, especially when you consider that most games these days don't even support demanding forms of Anti Aliasing, the same results can be achieved with a lesser GPU for sure.

If you're downsampling from higher resolutions, then yes, the 1080Ti is still needed.

That being said though if the intention is to keep the same GPU/Display for the next 5+ years then the headroom is probably there to continue playing the latest games @ 1080p 60fps for that amount of time.
   
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  (#27)
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Default 05-30-2017, 14:08 | posts: 596 | Location: Košice, Slovakia

Quote:
Originally Posted by anxious_f0x View Post
If you're downsampling from higher resolutions, then yes, the 1080Ti is still needed.
Indeed I am.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anxious_f0x View Post
That being said though if the intention is to keep the same GPU/Display for the next 5+ years then the headroom is probably there to continue playing the latest games @ 1080p 60fps for that amount of time.
The beauty of this plan is that even if I will buy new monitor next year, I already have horse power to run it decently.
   
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  (#28)
mikev190
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Default 05-30-2017, 14:24 | posts: 195 | Location: UK

Quote:
Originally Posted by pegasus1 View Post
A completely pointless analogy.
It's about as pointless as this post to be fair. Either way the OP will get his 1080ti or not.

To me its a waste, not because of money or whatever. More like having a powerful card being held back for a resolution it wasn't aimed at.

I agree with using downsampling, but personally I don't like how it looks compared to native.
   
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  (#29)
lucidus
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Default 05-30-2017, 14:46 | posts: 9,935 | Location: Republic of Kekistan

I bought a 780 at launch for what the 1080ti goes for these days for 1080p/60. I can't say I can fault you or anyone else for going 1080ti My 780 lasted me just over 3 years and probably would've lasted longer if I hadn't replaced it on a whim for more VRAM and to be rid of the stock cooler (I hit temperature limits often).
   
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  (#30)
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Default 05-30-2017, 14:47 | posts: 587

I don't know why people would say it doesn't make sense.

There are a dozen games that only run at 45fps avf with AA turned off with a 1080ti @4k, so it's safe to assume that there are drops...maybe 30-35 frames with that average.

If you are someone who wants all settings maxed including hairworks etc and other bloatware, and you want a 60 frame min at all times, you need a 1080ti @1080p.

I know people think that if you compromise at 4k and almost get 60avg that means it's overkill for 1080p but sometimes you justt want s buttery smooth no compromise experience. Nothing wrong with that.

EDIT: justsaw that he already has a 1080 and doesn't plan to buy a new monitor until next year...so no, it makes no sense.

I dare you to name 5 games that you plan to buy that are COMING OUT between now and next year when you buy your monitor that will not run at 60fps on the 1080 you have now...I can understand wanting to conquer the demanding back catalogue...but there is nothing coming out that would justifiy it and by the time you get your new monitor a new series of cards will have come out that are 60% faster than your 1080 compared to a 1080tu which is 35% faster...and you would get the newer one for the same money...

The only reason I upgraded from a 1080 to a 1080ti which will arrive this week....is because I am already at 4k and hence can't wait that long.

Last edited by Emille; 05-30-2017 at 14:52.
   
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  (#31)
Terepin
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Default 05-30-2017, 15:21 | posts: 596 | Location: Košice, Slovakia

I'm not planing to upgrade to Ti. I just wanted to discuss it, because it is popular opinion.

Actually, RotTR was too much at few place even for 1070. FC4 is too much even for 1080.

Games with built-in SSAA look spectacular at 4x (with the exception of RotTR, which somehow manages to look a lot worse). The Talos Principle is mesmerizing, Metro Redux breathtaking (although 1080 Ti can't run it smoothly at SSAA 4x, only 3x), The Vanishing of Ethan Carter Redux is pure porn for the eyes with SSAA 4x + TAA.

So you see, there is purpose of having 1080 Ti for 1080p/60 Hz monitor. And when 2080 comes out, it will too have sense to buy it for it.

Last edited by Terepin; 05-30-2017 at 15:25.
   
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  (#32)
RealNC
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Default 05-30-2017, 15:39 | posts: 989

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terepin View Post
1. VSync: Maintaining stable 60 FPS the whole time is the alpha and omega when using VSync.
You don't need a 1080 Ti for that though. For 60FPS, a 1080 will maintain that.

Quote:
2. Antialiasing: And I mean all of them. I guarantee you that I can make even 1080 Ti to choke blood while - unsuccessfully - trying to maintain stable 60 FPS. Just because I have 1080p/60 Hz monitor that doesn't mean I play games on that resolution as well.
That's not 1080p though. 4xSSAA or DSR 4x counts as 4K, not 1080p.

Quote:
3. Investment: Buying the most powerful card currently on the market and keeping it for, say, 7 years is significantly more advantageous than replacing 3 mainstream cards during the same time period (because of the reason above).
True.

Quote:
So you see, there is a reason to have a top gaming PC even if you don't have 4k/144 Hz monitor. And even when you do have one, the quest for perfection continues - to have stable 144 FPS at 4k resolution.
Sounds fine, except that I'd say you "need" at least 1080p@144Hz. Right now, the Ti is a bit of waste for 60Hz.

Also, the 1080 Ti is not enough for 4K@144Hz. The GPU that can deliver that on modern graphics-heavy games has not been invented yet. (Or at least not sold yet.)
   
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  (#33)
Emille
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Default 05-30-2017, 15:52 | posts: 587

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terepin View Post
I'm not planing to upgrade to Ti. I just wanted to discuss it, because it is popular opinion.

Actually, RotTR was too much at few place even for 1070. FC4 is too much even for 1080.

Games with built-in SSAA look spectacular at 4x (with the exception of RotTR, which somehow manages to look a lot worse). The Talos Principle is mesmerizing, Metro Redux breathtaking (although 1080 Ti can't run it smoothly at SSAA 4x, only 3x), The Vanishing of Ethan Carter Redux is pure porn for the eyes with SSAA 4x + TAA.

So you see, there is purpose of having 1080 Ti for 1080p/60 Hz monitor. And when 2080 comes out, it will too have sense to buy it for it.
It's not about whether you are going to upgarde....part of the argument for the merits of buying a gtx 1080ti for 1080p gaming has to include value. And value isn't calculated by working out relative frame rate to other cards per dollar, it is done by measuring that AGAINST what you currently have. So for me in australia...I just paid $1249+22shipping...so get a 35% performance increase, now you have to take into account what else is available...

If there had been a card with 50% increase for $1500, or a 70% increase for $1900...they would all have been better value because the performance INCREASE per dollar is much higher.

You also have to take into account the need/circumstance. I bought it because I am already at 4k and NEED it for smoother game, now I'm still not going to have as smooth a time with a ti at 4k as someone would be at 1080p with a regular gtx 1080...so my need was greater, further justifying spending the money if I want anything lose to the performance I want

So yes....a 1080ti for 1080p is justified...depending on what gpu you have and how much disposable money you have. Going from a 980 to a 1080ti would be probably a 100% increase...maybe a bit more in some cases. But for you...if you were in the market....you would be dumb to buy one given that you won't really need it to any non trivial degree until when you got a new monitor...by which time the next series will be out.
   
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  (#34)
airbud7
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Default 05-30-2017, 16:45 | posts: 4,092 | Location: Beech Island SC,USA

I wish I had y'alls kind of money!....My ugly wife would leave me if I bought a 1080ti on credit card....


Oh wait!.....That^ might be a good plan for me.....
   
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  (#35)
A M D BugBear
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Default 05-30-2017, 20:47 | posts: 2,417

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terepin View Post
Many (if not all) people think that this card is overkill/waste of money for 1080p/60 Hz gaming. It might look that way, but those people fail to realize 3 simple truths:
1. VSync: Maintaining stable 60 FPS the whole time is the alpha and omega when using VSync. Almost all reviews contain only average framerate numbers, which are useless for VSync. Minimal framerate is what counts and here powerful GPUs shines.
2. Antialiasing: And I mean all of them. I guarantee you that I can make even 1080 Ti to choke blood while - unsuccessfully - trying to maintain stable 60 FPS. Just because I have 1080p/60 Hz monitor that doesn't mean I play games on that resolution as well.
3. Investment: Buying the most powerful card currently on the market and keeping it for, say, 7 years is significantly more advantageous than replacing 3 mainstream cards during the same time period (because of the reason above).

So you see, there is a reason to have a top gaming PC even if you don't have 4k/144 Hz monitor. And even when you do have one, the quest for perfection continues - to have stable 144 FPS at 4k resolution.
I mostly only game @ 1600p or higher with sick ass quality settings and hardware forced aa through via(nvidia inspector).

I agree on the Anti-aliasing part, Try running BF1 or any today's games w/enhance aa + nvidia inspector 8xmsaa + 8xsgssaa, Or even @ 32xs, !!!!!

But watch out, your video card or cards can and will exceed the tdp limit, and the card will freeze like no tommorrow, unless you modded your card's tdp to handle the extra juice cause SparseGrid AA does add Quite a bit more Power draw to your cards.

I know, while doing some benchmark testing with BF 4, with 8xmsaa+8xsgssaa, the card was going over tdp limit, I had to further do some bios tweaking, now its fully stable, does not throttle down, its at 325 tdp now, temps are decent.

But the problem is, If I go below my native resolution, it becomes BLURRR-RY!!.

Last edited by A M D BugBear; 05-30-2017 at 20:52.
   
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  (#36)
TimmyP
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Default 05-30-2017, 21:10 | posts: 482 | Location: Reality

Obviously this reads like you are trying to justify your purchase
   
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  (#37)
Witcher29
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Default 05-30-2017, 23:17 | posts: 807 | Location: Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terepin View Post
OK, you guys who think this is an overkill, why exactly you think that? State your reasons.
Because 60 hz [60 fps for that card on 1080p is overkill even with AA
If u have a 120 hz or 144 hertz monitor then its a different story.

Unless u using DSR that with AA on top of it then its no overkill
   
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  (#38)
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Default 05-30-2017, 23:33 | posts: 17,643 | Location: Glasgow

It's definitely not overkill.

Maybe in the past it would have, but nowadays with things like DSR and many games having their own downsampling solution it is very easy to tax a 1080ti on a 1080/60 screen.
   
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  (#39)
Agent-A01
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Default 05-31-2017, 00:05 | posts: 9,392 | Location: USA

1080P 60FPS Vsync, that's gross.
   
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  (#40)
Netherwind
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Default 05-31-2017, 10:40 | posts: 4,836 | Location: Sweden

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terepin View Post
OK, you guys who think this is an overkill, why exactly you think that? State your reasons.
I think its great chasing a dream of being able to play at your monitor's maximum specifications and you'll definitely do that with a 1080Ti.

I'm also chasing that dream but it's much harder at 1440p/144Hz.
   
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  (#41)
RealNC
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Default 05-31-2017, 12:25 | posts: 989

Quote:
Originally Posted by Redemption80 View Post
It's definitely not overkill.

Maybe in the past it would have, but nowadays with things like DSR and many games having their own downsampling solution it is very easy to tax a 1080ti on a 1080/60 screen.
That's 4K, not 1080p.

The screen has nothing do with game resolution.
   
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  (#42)
Terepin
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Default 05-31-2017, 12:29 | posts: 596 | Location: Košice, Slovakia

Quote:
Originally Posted by RealNC View Post
That's 4K, not 1080p.

The screen has nothing do with game resolution.
But the point of this discussion is about 1080p/60 Hz screen.
   
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  (#43)
fantaskarsef
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Default 05-31-2017, 12:32 | posts: 6,733 | Location: Austria (no kangaroos here)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Netherwind View Post
I think its great chasing a dream of being able to play at your monitor's maximum specifications and you'll definitely do that with a 1080Ti.

I'm also chasing that dream but it's much harder at 1440p/144Hz.
Amen brother, I hear you on that dream
   
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  (#44)
RealNC
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Default 05-31-2017, 12:58 | posts: 989

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terepin View Post
But the point of this discussion is about 1080p/60 Hz screen.
Well, the thread then would seem to claim that "many people" consider a 1080 Ti to be overkill for a 1080p *screen*.

That is not true. Nobody is saying that. OK, maybe not nobody, but it's certainly not the popular belief. What the popular belief actually *is*, is that the 1080 Ti is overkill for 1080p gaming. You can do 1080p gaming on a 4K monitor if you wanted. And DSR to 4K on a 1080p screen is not 1080p gaming, it's 4K gaming.

Those are two different things :-/

Perhaps you should clarify.

Last edited by RealNC; 05-31-2017 at 13:01.
   
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  (#45)
Redemption80
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Default 05-31-2017, 13:39 | posts: 17,643 | Location: Glasgow

Tbf, I thought his post was pretty clear which is why i made my comments.

The OP mentions higher resolutions than 19x10, but maybe the thread should be renamed to why a 1080ti makes every on a 1080/60 screen?
   
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  (#46)
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Default 05-31-2017, 15:24 | posts: 7,084

By the same standards OP believes 1080p 60hz for 1080ti is acceptable, why werent people still on 1280x1024 or 1680x1050 with 780ti when that was top card? You could have made the same argument for the lesser res, older card as you are for 1080ti today.

For some silly reason, 1080p is seen by some as an eternal resolution which can be justified even by a 3070ti some 3 years from now.
   
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  (#47)
Emille
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Default 05-31-2017, 15:35 | posts: 587

Quote:
Originally Posted by alanm View Post
By the same standards OP believes 1080p 60hz for 1080ti is acceptable, why werent people still on 1280x1024 or 1680x1050 with 780ti when that was top card? You could have made the same argument for the lesser res, older card as you are for 1080ti today.

For some silly reason, 1080p is seen by some as an eternal resolution which can be justified even by a 3070ti some 3 years from now.
Seriously? Do you REALLY not see the difference between 1280x1024 or 1680x1050 on a 780ti compared to 1080p on a 1080ti?

Firstly literally no one who owned a 780ti ran with a screen with a native res or aspect ratio of a 1280x1024 screen, next it is extremely unlikely that when the 780ti was out that more than 0.05% of pc users were even using 16x10 displays anymore. They basically stopped making that aspect ratio as soon as 1920x1080 became the standard res and ratio for what would become full hd tvs. So in both of your examples you would be running non native res and non native aspect ration...

1080p is the standard....and it will be for years. Standard aspect ratio and native res for almost all pc gaming monitors. 1080p was also a long established standard when the 780ti was out so your example makes no sense.

60hz monitors are also standard and would make up well of 99.9% of all monitors refresh rates, so it is a very reasonable and rational standard to try and fullfill to it's greatest capability.
   
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  (#48)
alanm
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Default 05-31-2017, 17:01 | posts: 7,084

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emille View Post
Seriously? Do you REALLY not see the difference between 1280x1024 or 1680x1050 on a 780ti compared to 1080p on a 1080ti?

Firstly literally no one who owned a 780ti ran with a screen with a native res or aspect ratio of a 1280x1024 screen, next it is extremely unlikely that when the 780ti was out that more than 0.05% of pc users were even using 16x10 displays anymore. They basically stopped making that aspect ratio as soon as 1920x1080 became the standard res and ratio for what would become full hd tvs. So in both of your examples you would be running non native res and non native aspect ration...

1080p is the standard....and it will be for years. Standard aspect ratio and native res for almost all pc gaming monitors. 1080p was also a long established standard when the 780ti was out so your example makes no sense.

60hz monitors are also standard and would make up well of 99.9% of all monitors refresh rates, so it is a very reasonable and rational standard to try and fullfill to it's greatest capability.
You missed the point. Yes, we know 1080p is the standard (for the masses). Of course 1280x1024 looks horrible and 1680x1050 not far behind. But to many (with capable hardware), 1080p 60hz is now just as off-putting today as those lower resolutions many years ago. So why the F would anyone with capable hardware forgo 1440p (or higher) just for sake of 16x or 32x AA on 1080p? The latter would still not look as good or as immersive. That is assuming proper size monitors for these resolutions. With 1080p you are stuck on small monitors (24", unless you like seeing pixels). 1440p you can go 27-32". Bottom line, higher res on bigger displays even with lower AA is more appealing than lower res and higher AA on small monitors. DSR sucks vs native and you're still stuck with small monitors using it. That is the major point against 1080p monitors (for enthusiasts with capable HW, imo).
   
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  (#49)
RealNC
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Default 05-31-2017, 17:12 | posts: 989

Quote:
Originally Posted by alanm View Post
DSR sucks vs native and you're still stuck with small monitors using it. That is the major point against 1080p monitors (for enthusiasts with capable HW, imo).
Nah, I have to disagree here. Downsampling/supersampling results in an image with less artifacts compared to native 4K displays. Shimmering due to aliasing is still a thing with 4K displays. 4K on a 1080p display has virtually no shimmering.

That doesn't mean downsampled 4K is better than native, of course. I'm just saying that there are some benefits to downsampling vs native.
   
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  (#50)
Netherwind
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Default 05-31-2017, 17:18 | posts: 4,836 | Location: Sweden

Quote:
Originally Posted by fantaskarsef View Post
Amen brother, I hear you on that dream
Maybe one day mate
   
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