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scitek
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Default 04-02-2012, 19:45 | posts: 119

Quote:
Originally Posted by slickric21 View Post
Okay finally got time to post some shots in BF3 without MLAA.

As you will see the CF(Edge detect) doesn't appear to be working at all.

The EQ mode does effect fps negatively- and is altering the image, but not really improving it vs ordinary x4MSAA.

Supersampling eats fps and results in more blurring of the fence vs Adaptive which costs only 1fps !!

Anyway have a look for yourself, all shots taken at 1080p Ultra with AA mode stated in picture, fps top right corner.

So clearly AMD/ATI did something right with the Adaptive sampling this time, its virtually free and does a great job.
Yeah, I've noticed in most games that SSAA is too blurry, and EQ works effectively in some cases, and hardly at all in others. Bulletstorm uses EQ pretty well, but something like BF3 doesn't. I usually stick with 4xAdaptive AA + injected FXAA if the performance hit with Adaptive isn't too high, otherwise I'll just use 4xMSAA + FXAA. It usually gets most of the jaggies but retains 60fps.
   
 
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BlackZero
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Default 01-16-2013, 23:30 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

It's been a while since the AA compatibility list was updated. This was mostly because I had been using a Radeon 6 series graphics card and AMD did not extend DX11 driver level antialiasing capabilities to that series.

I have since purchased a Radeon 7 series graphics card and can now continue to add new (and old) games to the list as I get around to testing them.


AA game compatibility list updated.


Added:

Battlefield 3


Image Comparisons:


Battlefield 3: NO AA




Battlefield 3: 4x MSAA




Battlefield 3: 4x EQ Edge Detect MSAA




Battlefield 3: 4x EQ Adaptive MSAA




Battlefield 3: 4x EQ SSAA




Battlefield 3: 4x EQ Edge Detect SSAA




In game post filter AA was disabled, and a resolution of 1920x1200 was used. Other than MLAA, enhanced AA was the only form that could be enabled from the control panel, overriding did not work. I could not confirm if Edge detect was working correctly.

This is of course in line with what slickric21 has previously posted.


Edit

And a few further Comparisons for anyone interested.


No AA




4x MSAA (Ingame)




4x EQ Edge Detect MSAA




4x EQ Adaptive MSAA




4x EQ SSAA


Last edited by BlackZero; 01-17-2013 at 01:09.
   
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  (#78)
The Mac
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Default 01-17-2013, 01:47 | posts: 4,407 | Location: USA

Yay!

this my go to thread when someone has a problem.

Welcome to CGN BlackZero!
   
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  (#79)
BlackZero
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Default 01-17-2013, 02:02 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

Thanks!

Quite enjoying the higher performance and new features, looking forward to adding more titles. I have got quite a backlog to catch up on.
   
 
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Shaneus
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Default 01-17-2013, 02:07 | posts: 268 | Location: Geelong, Australia

How do you mean "this time"... new card generation, drivers, other software? I want to know if there's something I should tinker with again

Edit: Nevermind... but did I catch a post that was edited later? I could swear that I was looking at some different screens!
Edit again: You definitely did... because the host you used in the updated one is blocked at work, where the other ones worked fine. Can I ask why you removed them?

Last edited by Shaneus; 01-17-2013 at 02:12.
   
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  (#81)
BlackZero
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Default 01-17-2013, 02:23 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

If you mean the last post with battlefield 3 images then it is using the same host for them all, this includes the later images. The reason I edited it was because the original links were not going through to the full images but just the smaller 'face' images.
   
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Shaneus
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Default 01-17-2013, 09:23 | posts: 268 | Location: Geelong, Australia

Um, don't mind me... I just realised that the completely different screens I was looking at was from a page earlier. I was at work so really shouldn't have been reading this thread anyway Apologies for the confusion!

Appreciate your work too, BTW

Last edited by Shaneus; 01-17-2013 at 09:27.
   
Old
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BlackZero
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Default 01-17-2013, 18:23 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

Thank you, Shaneus.

Also wanted to add that the guide has now been updated to reflect the recent developments concerning DX10 and DX11 based supersampling, as well as the new MLAA revision.

There is still some confusion regarding older supersampling techniques and whether the new techniques apply to all graphics cards including those limited to DX9 based supersampling. I will try to add more details regrading this once I have more information.
   
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  (#84)
The Mac
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Default 01-17-2013, 19:16 | posts: 4,407 | Location: USA

just went through the op again to read your updates..

I had no idea AA for dx10/dx11 could only be enabled by enhance application setting, and you have no control over it, it does what it wants.

no wonder it never seemed to do anything.
   
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BlackZero
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Default 01-17-2013, 19:35 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

It is further explained in the driver release notes.

http://support.amd.com/us/kbarticles...easeNotes.aspx
   
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The Mac
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Default 01-17-2013, 19:48 | posts: 4,407 | Location: USA

yeah, but it doesnt actually say "enhance application" needs to be on. Thats news to me.
   
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BlackZero
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Default 01-17-2013, 20:13 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

There would be no other way to enable it.

Quote:
Applications must support in game Anti-Aliasing for the feature to work (Forced on Anti-Aliasing through the Catalyst Control Center is not supported for DirectX 10 and DirectX 11 applications)
   
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  (#88)
The Mac
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Default 01-17-2013, 20:18 | posts: 4,407 | Location: USA

I think you missed my point.

I scratched my head for a long time on how to enable it and just gave up.

No where does it explicitly say how to enable it.

Im supposed to guess using enhance application settings tuns it on?

come on....
   
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  (#89)
BlackZero
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Default 01-17-2013, 20:34 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

I suppose it's just another example of the ambiguities faced by catalyst users.
   
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  (#90)
The Mac
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Default 01-17-2013, 20:53 | posts: 4,407 | Location: USA

To be honest, its the first real ambiguity ive run into...

There a lot of confusing stuff with regards to AA, but most of it isnt real ambiguous.
   
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BlackZero
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Default 01-17-2013, 22:48 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

Looks like AMD have swapped around their definition of antialiasing mode and method, or perhaps I understood it wrong in the past.

I've updated the guide to this effect, though the changes in layout may also need to be addressed.
   
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BlackZero
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Default 01-18-2013, 23:13 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

The Guide has now been updated for the latest control panel changes.


AA game compatibility list updated.


Added:

Hitman Absolution, The Secret World


The secret World did not allow any form of traditional antialiasing. Hitman Absolution allowed all forms of antialiasing in enhanced mode.


Image Comparisons:


Hitman Absolution: NO AA




Hitman Absolution: 2x MSAA (In-game)




Hitman Absolution: 2x EQ Edge Detect SSAA




Hitman Absolution: 4x MSAA (In-game)




Hitman Absolution: 4x EQ Edge Detect MSAA




Hitman Absolution: 4x EQ Adaptive MSAA




Hitman Absolution: 4x EQ Edge Detect Adaptive MSAA




Hitman Absolution: 4x EQ SSAA




Hitman Absolution: 4x EQ Edge Detect SSAA




Hitman Absolution: 8x MSAA (In-game)




Hitman Absolution: 8x EQ Edge Detect SSAA





And a few further Hitman Absolution images at 1920x1200 for anyone interested. All images using 2x EQ Edge Detect SSAA.










http://postimage.org/image/o5craqs9f/
http://postimage.org/image/x1njeoivn/
http://postimage.org/image/89nx7g1oz/
   
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  (#93)
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Default 01-18-2013, 23:28 | posts: 92

Does edge detect still hit fps really hard? I haven't tried it for a long time. Like others, I don't really like the blur of SSAA, so maybe adaptive + edge detect is the way to go?
   
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BlackZero
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Default 01-18-2013, 23:44 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

It would depend on the game, though for the DX11 games I've tried so far it seems to be quite subtle and not as demanding. Same can be said for supersampling, and with the auto LOD adjustment now added it should be less of a concern.

Having said that, SSAA does still add some blur to Hitman Absolution in the images above. I would need to test more DX10/DX11 games with SGSSAA, but it's a light form of SSAA so the added blur shouldn't be as obvious as other forms of SSAA can be in some games.

The last few images are using 2x Edge Detect SSAA and the image quality seems quite reasonable with very little noticeable blur.
   
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BlackZero
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Default 01-21-2013, 00:08 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

AA game compatibility list updated.


Added:

Batman Arkham City (DX11/DX9), Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines, X3: Terran Conflict

Batman Arkham City seems to have been designed to minimise the need for antialiasing, this makes it difficult to spot any differences. I could see subtle differences by concentrating on Batman's left side in the images below.


Image Comparisons:


Batman Arkham City DX11 - Enhanced Mode Only

Batman Arkham City: NO AA




Batman Arkham City: 2x MSAA (In-game)




Batman Arkham City: 2x Adaptive MSAA




Batman Arkham City: 2x SSAA




Batman Arkham City: 2x Edge Detect SSAA




Batman Arkham City: 4x MSAA (In-game)




Batman Arkham City: 4x SSAA




Batman Arkham City: 4x Edge Detect SSAA





Batman Arkham City DX9

Batman Arkham City: No AA




Batman Arkham City: 4x Adaptive MSAA (Enhanced)




Batman Arkham City: 8x MSAA (Forced)




Batman Arkham City: 8x SSAA (Forced)




Batman Arkham City: 12x EQ Edge Detect Adaptive MSAA (Forced)




Batman Arkham City: 24x EQ Edge Adaptive MSAA (forced)


Last edited by BlackZero; 01-21-2013 at 00:25.
   
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BlackZero
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Default 01-21-2013, 00:24 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines

VTM: Bloodlines does not support in-game antialiasing. It must be forced.


Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: NO AA




Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: 4x MSAA




Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: 4x SSAA




Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: 12x Edge Detect SSAA




Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: 12x EQ Edge Detect SSAA




Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: 24x Edge Detect Adaptive MSAA




Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: 24x Edge Detect SSAA




Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines: 24x EQ Edge Detect SSAA





X3: Terran Conflict

X3 Terran Conflict: NO AA




X3 Terran Conflict: 4x MSAA (In-game)



X3 Terran Conflict: 4x Edge Detect SSAA (Enhanced)




X3 Terran Conflict: 4x MSAA




X3 Terran Conflict: 24x EQ Edge Detect MSAA




X3 Terran Conflict: 24x EQ Edge Detect Adaptive MSAA




X3 Terran Conflict: 24x EQ Edge Detect SSAA




Edit:

The guide has now been partially rewritten and re-formatted.

Last edited by BlackZero; 01-21-2013 at 09:24.
   
Best setting for Borderlands 2?
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moheban79
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Default Best setting for Borderlands 2? - 01-21-2013, 00:43 | posts: 198 | Location: worcester, ma

Hi,

Was wondering what is a good AA setting for Borderlands 2? I read that FXAA is adequate but am using an injectSMAA utility instead. What do you guys think?

Thanks
   
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  (#98)
BlackZero
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Default 01-21-2013, 01:48 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

I personally do not own borderlands 2 so can't provide much information, I do however know that some people prefer to use downsampling for that game, likely as other antialiasing methods either don't work or are not very effective.

In any case, I am only guessing here so perhaps someone with first hand knowledge can add more.
   
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Mojojojo
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Default 01-27-2013, 11:03 | posts: 2

Hi I made an account just to reply to this thread.

I've been running similar tests and scratching my head trying to figure out what AA modes are running and working/not working.

I have a problem though. If I enable enhance application settings in CCC, I don't get the options to pick 2x, 2xeq, ect. The samples box is greyed out and I cannot choose anything in it.

I can only access this box if I select override application settings. I know this option does not work with most games.

I basically want to run 2xSSAA whenever possible. From my own tests I've had the highest frame rates at 2xAA compared to 8xMSAA or 4xMSAA with AAA. The picture quality has also probably been better.

How do I go about doing this?

I was originally using "use application settings" with super sampling set as the AA mode. I thought if I had AA set to 2 in game options then it would use SS as the AA method regardless of the games settings. This is wrong I assume.

So I should be setting enhance app settings? Do I still set the in game AA to the level I want my SSAA at?

Thanks for making the effort to clear this up. I can't find any recent articles on professional sites doing these tests.

I'm using driver cata 13.1

Last edited by Mojojojo; 01-27-2013 at 11:42.
   
Old
  (#100)
BlackZero
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Default 01-27-2013, 11:51 | posts: 8,163 | Location: United Kingdom

Mojojojo

Your assumption was in fact correct. The only way to increase antialiasing samples when using the enhance application settings mode is to do so from the in-game antialiasing settings. Of course, it would require multisample antialiasing to be supported and enabled in-game and simply goes about by adding the 'EQ' samples to the sample settings in-game from what I understand.

If using a 7 series GPU you can also enhance the in-game multisampling settings by choosing any of the available antialiasing methods from the control panel. This would include supersampling, and is in fact the only way to do so for dx10/dx11 applications as they do not allow the force antialiasing method setting.

In the specific example you listed, to apply 2x SSAA, you would enable 2x MSAA in-game while enabling the enhance application settings mode from the control panel with supersampling antialiasing as the method. So what you would end up with is 2xEQ SSAA in-game. Also, in some cases and almost always for DX10/DX11 applications, you might need to modify the control panel settings before you launch the application.

I like to believe the guide is relatively detailed regarding this matter, if you feel it's not very clear in some part please let me know and I'd be happy to make the required changes.
   
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