Guru3D.com Forums

Go Back   Guru3D.com Forums > General > Operating Systems
Operating Systems Is Windows 8.1 giving you a hard time ? Wanna try out Windows 10 ?



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old
  (#76)
Cybermancer
Don Quixote
 
Cybermancer's Avatar
 
Videocard: BFG GTX260OC (192 SP)
Processor: Intel E8400 @ 3.6 GHz
Mainboard: XFX 680i LT
Memory: 6 GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400
Soundcard: X-Fi
PSU: PC Power & Cooling 750W
Default 04-22-2009, 12:46 | posts: 13,801 | Location: Cyberspace

This thread needs to get back on track, please.

BF2 and RAM prices belong into a PM.
   
Reply With Quote
 
Old
  (#77)
snip3r_3
Ancient Guru
 
snip3r_3's Avatar
 
Videocard: 1070
Processor: 5820K
Mainboard: ASUS X99-A
Memory: 16GB Corsair Vengence LPX
Soundcard: X-Fi Titanium HD
PSU: Corsair AX850
Default 04-22-2009, 13:19 | posts: 2,985 | Location: Tokyo

I don't find disabling pagefile any faster than with it on. I don't find 4gb->8gb any faster either =(

When you are in a game, for example, erm Left 4 Dead or Team Fortress 2, and you alt-tab, how long does getting back into the game take for you? I have like a 5~7 second black screen that doesn't get any shorter with more RAM or PF disabled or set to a small amount. haha
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#78)
VultureX
Banned
 
Videocard: MSI GTX970 SLI
Processor: Core i7 2700K @4.8GHz H2O
Mainboard: Asrock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3
Memory: 8GB G.Skill 2133MHz CL9
Soundcard: Xonar Essence ST - Z-5500
PSU: Corsair TX850 V2
Default 04-22-2009, 13:38 | posts: 2,577 | Location: Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pillmonster View Post
Well of course SSD's are faster than HDD's with platters. But they are still nowhere the speed of RAM. If they were, we wouldn't need ram now would we?
Of course you'd still need RAM... You wouldn't be able to play a game and copy files at the same time or other multiple read/write operations... All memory load on 1 disk would cause serious slowdowns.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pillmonster View Post
That's why you need a decent amount of RAM installed before you can turn off your page file...I think 8Gb is prob enough.
Yes, for that reason it's not practical for most people. There are also other problems. If your PC crashes all the data stored in the pagefile on your RAM would be instantly lost.
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#79)
Mr.Bigtime
Ancient Guru
 
Mr.Bigtime's Avatar
 
Videocard: ASUS 1080TI
Processor: Intel I7 6770K
Mainboard: ASUS STRIX
Memory: 16GB DD4 2133 MHz
Soundcard: EDIFIER LUNA ECLIPSE Red
PSU: 1000
Default 04-22-2009, 14:22 | posts: 20,718 | Location: Turkey

Anyway people this is not a big deal...iam happy with no page file..and u r happy with page file..any problems ? no in both sides.
   
Reply With Quote
 
Old
  (#80)
Pill Monster
Banned
 
Videocard: 7950 Vapor-X 1100/1500
Processor: AMD FX-8320 @4.7
Mainboard: ASUS Sabertooth 990FX R2
Memory: 8GB HyperX Beast 2400
Soundcard: X-Fi Fatal1ty, Wharfedale
PSU: AcBel M8 750 Bronze
Default 04-22-2009, 14:43 | posts: 25,234 | Location: NZ

I lubz you all


Quote:
Originally Posted by VultureX View Post
Of course you'd still need RAM... You wouldn't be able to play a game and copy files at the same time or other multiple read/write operations... All memory load on 1 disk would cause serious slowdowns.
Yes, but If you had like 20 HDDS it would be ok....they'd have to be fast though....


Quote:
If your PC crashes all the data stored in the pagefile on your RAM would be instantly lost.
Why would that matter?
With a PF on your hard drive you'd still lose whatever data was stored in ram....it's no different.

Last edited by Pill Monster; 04-22-2009 at 15:02.
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#81)
Athena79
Banned
 
Videocard: GTX 260
Processor: Q8200
Mainboard: ASUS
Memory: Too much to list
Soundcard: OnBoard
PSU: 700WATT
Default 04-22-2009, 17:00 | posts: 83 | Location: The Milky Way

i hate pagefile!! cant disable mine
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#82)
Cybermancer
Don Quixote
 
Cybermancer's Avatar
 
Videocard: BFG GTX260OC (192 SP)
Processor: Intel E8400 @ 3.6 GHz
Mainboard: XFX 680i LT
Memory: 6 GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400
Soundcard: X-Fi
PSU: PC Power & Cooling 750W
Default 04-22-2009, 17:02 | posts: 13,801 | Location: Cyberspace

Quote:
Originally Posted by Athena79 View Post
i hate pagefile!! cant disable mine
Why not?
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#83)
Athena79
Banned
 
Videocard: GTX 260
Processor: Q8200
Mainboard: ASUS
Memory: Too much to list
Soundcard: OnBoard
PSU: 700WATT
Default 04-22-2009, 17:17 | posts: 83 | Location: The Milky Way

Wont let me...ive tried all the walkthrus just wont work
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#84)
Cybermancer
Don Quixote
 
Cybermancer's Avatar
 
Videocard: BFG GTX260OC (192 SP)
Processor: Intel E8400 @ 3.6 GHz
Mainboard: XFX 680i LT
Memory: 6 GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400
Soundcard: X-Fi
PSU: PC Power & Cooling 750W
Default 04-22-2009, 17:20 | posts: 13,801 | Location: Cyberspace

You're using Vista x64, right? How much RAM do you have? Your specs don't have that info filled in.
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#85)
Athena79
Banned
 
Videocard: GTX 260
Processor: Q8200
Mainboard: ASUS
Memory: Too much to list
Soundcard: OnBoard
PSU: 700WATT
Default 04-22-2009, 17:38 | posts: 83 | Location: The Milky Way

8gb X64
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#86)
Cybermancer
Don Quixote
 
Cybermancer's Avatar
 
Videocard: BFG GTX260OC (192 SP)
Processor: Intel E8400 @ 3.6 GHz
Mainboard: XFX 680i LT
Memory: 6 GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400
Soundcard: X-Fi
PSU: PC Power & Cooling 750W
Default 04-22-2009, 17:43 | posts: 13,801 | Location: Cyberspace

Hm. What exactly does happen when you try to disable it? Do you get any error messages?
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#87)
Pill Monster
Banned
 
Videocard: 7950 Vapor-X 1100/1500
Processor: AMD FX-8320 @4.7
Mainboard: ASUS Sabertooth 990FX R2
Memory: 8GB HyperX Beast 2400
Soundcard: X-Fi Fatal1ty, Wharfedale
PSU: AcBel M8 750 Bronze
Default 04-22-2009, 17:47 | posts: 25,234 | Location: NZ

Quote:
Originally Posted by Athena79 View Post
Wont let me...ive tried all the walkthrus just wont work
Have you got admin rights?
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#88)
Athena79
Banned
 
Videocard: GTX 260
Processor: Q8200
Mainboard: ASUS
Memory: Too much to list
Soundcard: OnBoard
PSU: 700WATT
Default 04-22-2009, 18:00 | posts: 83 | Location: The Milky Way

Yeah...least i think i do
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#89)
soldier1st
Master Guru
 
Videocard: ATI Radeon HD 4250
Processor: AMD Phenom Triple Core
Mainboard: AMD Based
Memory: 4GB DDR3
Soundcard: ATI High Definition
PSU: 500Watt Generic
Default 04-22-2009, 19:21 | posts: 196 | Location: Enterprise NX01

when i disabled mine vista would act strange so to be safe i let the OS manage it and no problems.
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#90)
smnoamls
Maha Guru
 
smnoamls's Avatar
 
Videocard: 6950 2gb Dirt3 @6970 bios
Processor: i5 2500k@4.3
Mainboard: Gigabyte z68x ud3
Memory: 8GB gskill
Soundcard: x-fi xtremeGamer
PSU: 620 thermalte PSU
Default 04-22-2009, 19:35 | posts: 1,426 | Location: israel

Quote:
If your PC crashes all the data stored in the pagefile on your RAM would be instantly lost.
Untrue
The page file can and does hold data that the system can use to "heal" certain sectors which were in mid write.
Despite what many people think, windows does a very adequate job of optimizing memory use. The HD use is for the users protection.

The best option is to set a set sized page file.
Set the upper and lower limit to the same size, such as 4gb ( people with 8gb ram rarely have a hard drive space problem ).
The main "grinding" of the hard drive used in paging operations are the resizing of the page file, not the access.
This will give you the greatest speed benefit, and windows will only access it as needed ABOVE the 8gb ram OR in case it needs to for redundancy reason.

PS: Im a software engineer for IBM storage division
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#91)
Pill Monster
Banned
 
Videocard: 7950 Vapor-X 1100/1500
Processor: AMD FX-8320 @4.7
Mainboard: ASUS Sabertooth 990FX R2
Memory: 8GB HyperX Beast 2400
Soundcard: X-Fi Fatal1ty, Wharfedale
PSU: AcBel M8 750 Bronze
Default 04-22-2009, 19:50 | posts: 25,234 | Location: NZ

Just to sidetrack for second, are you saying that if the high/low sizes are the same (which I also agree is the best method btw..) that the PF won't be accessed until that amount of system RAM has been used up?
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#92)
smnoamls
Maha Guru
 
smnoamls's Avatar
 
Videocard: 6950 2gb Dirt3 @6970 bios
Processor: i5 2500k@4.3
Mainboard: Gigabyte z68x ud3
Memory: 8GB gskill
Soundcard: x-fi xtremeGamer
PSU: 620 thermalte PSU
Default 04-22-2009, 20:02 | posts: 1,426 | Location: israel

Not exactly (although my post implied just that )
It will use the HD when the maximum amount of ram the process needs is used.
More often than not the process will not be able to use the whole 8 gb.
This is not only due to 32 vs 64 bit applications, but due to mapping constraints in the software itself.
The program itself might be programmed to use only a certain amount of memory due to its own limitations , whether as designed by the programmer or due to laziness of aforementioned programmer.
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#93)
VultureX
Banned
 
Videocard: MSI GTX970 SLI
Processor: Core i7 2700K @4.8GHz H2O
Mainboard: Asrock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3
Memory: 8GB G.Skill 2133MHz CL9
Soundcard: Xonar Essence ST - Z-5500
PSU: Corsair TX850 V2
Default 04-22-2009, 21:57 | posts: 2,577 | Location: Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by smnoamls View Post
Untrue
The page file can and does hold data that the system can use to "heal" certain sectors which were in mid write.
Despite what many people think, windows does a very adequate job of optimizing memory use. The HD use is for the users protection.

The best option is to set a set sized page file.
Set the upper and lower limit to the same size, such as 4gb ( people with 8gb ram rarely have a hard drive space problem ).
The main "grinding" of the hard drive used in paging operations are the resizing of the page file, not the access.
This will give you the greatest speed benefit, and windows will only access it as needed ABOVE the 8gb ram OR in case it needs to for redundancy reason.

PS: Im a software engineer for IBM storage division
Erm, I'm not sure.. Either you don't understand me or I don't understand you.

If you have disabled your pagefile, all the data is stored in your RAM, right? You sort of have the pagefile you usually have on your harddisk stored in RAM, right? So if your PC crashes all that data is instantly lost, cos the RAM is completely erased after power off or system reboot...
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#94)
morfeus02
Maha Guru
 
Videocard: Sapphire HD4870 1GB GDDR5
Processor: Intel Q8200@3Ghz- H2O -
Mainboard: Asus P5N-D
Memory: 8GB DDR2 800@900mhz
Soundcard: Audigy SE@X-fi softmod
PSU: TT ToughPower 600w 48A
Default 04-22-2009, 22:03 | posts: 1,460 | Location: Italy

Quote:
Originally Posted by VultureX View Post
Erm, I'm not sure.. Either you don't understand me or I don't understand you.

If you have disabled your pagefile, all the data is stored in your RAM, right? You sort of have the pagefile you usually have on your harddisk stored in RAM, right? So if your PC crashes all that data is instantly lost, cos the RAM is completely erased after power off or system reboot...


good point
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#95)
smnoamls
Maha Guru
 
smnoamls's Avatar
 
Videocard: 6950 2gb Dirt3 @6970 bios
Processor: i5 2500k@4.3
Mainboard: Gigabyte z68x ud3
Memory: 8GB gskill
Soundcard: x-fi xtremeGamer
PSU: 620 thermalte PSU
Default 04-23-2009, 09:13 | posts: 1,426 | Location: israel

Listen, at the time when I finished studying my OS courses in Uni, win2k was the bleeding edge OS, not readily accepted and considered too gaudy by many ( sounds familiar? ).

My suggestion , as a storage so called expert ( which I am not, I just work in the field ):
Dont believe me.
Dont believe self claiming experts or hearsay or even expert forums.
Always go to the horses mouth and read and reread the whitepapers and tech docs and find out for yourself.
a good place to start:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/314482
http://search.techrepublic.com.com/s...nd+paging.html
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/889654
http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windo...ing-file-size/

Specifically make sure you use microsofts database. Even though they are an evil empire, they did write the OS. They usually know best
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#96)
WhiteLightning
Don Illuminati
 
WhiteLightning's Avatar
 
Videocard: Inno3d GTX 1070 iChill x4
Processor: 2600k HT@4 .5 + NZXT X61
Mainboard: MSI Z77A-GD65 GAMING
Memory: Gskill 2133Mhz 8GB
Soundcard: Onboard
PSU: Seasonic 750 Watt
Default 04-23-2009, 09:24 | posts: 26,568 | Location: Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by smnoamls View Post
Even though they are an evil empire, they did write the OS. They usually know best
i seriously doubt that. why are there so many hacks/ways/applications out there to make the os running way better then you could with "standard" windows ?
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#97)
smnoamls
Maha Guru
 
smnoamls's Avatar
 
Videocard: 6950 2gb Dirt3 @6970 bios
Processor: i5 2500k@4.3
Mainboard: Gigabyte z68x ud3
Memory: 8GB gskill
Soundcard: x-fi xtremeGamer
PSU: 620 thermalte PSU
Default 04-23-2009, 09:27 | posts: 1,426 | Location: israel

I did not mean to go by their suggestions.
I meant read the way the system works.
And construct your own methods.
But the constant risk of any hacker or developer for that matter is assumptions.
We assume so many things and base out actions on them we sometimes do more harm then good.
the reading material I sent was meant to give more info as to how to better optimize performance, not to give you someone elses opinion of what is right.
This is a gurus forum, you are supposed to figure out the best way to overcharge your OS and hardware.
Just do it based on real information.
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#98)
Mr.Bigtime
Ancient Guru
 
Mr.Bigtime's Avatar
 
Videocard: ASUS 1080TI
Processor: Intel I7 6770K
Mainboard: ASUS STRIX
Memory: 16GB DD4 2133 MHz
Soundcard: EDIFIER LUNA ECLIPSE Red
PSU: 1000
Default 04-23-2009, 09:41 | posts: 20,718 | Location: Turkey

Quote:
Originally Posted by VultureX View Post
Erm, I'm not sure.. Either you don't understand me or I don't understand you.

If you have disabled your pagefile, all the data is stored in your RAM, right? You sort of have the pagefile you usually have on your harddisk stored in RAM, right? So if your PC crashes all that data is instantly lost, cos the RAM is completely erased after power off or system reboot...
Is there a way to restore data from ur PAGEFILE?

and i never had a problem about LOST DATA...theories theories theories. i myself dont know how THINGS work in Vista 64 OLS. i mean game fi***351;les loads to RAm and u play. then ur pc shutdown..what u expect? restore game files?

U work on a word file..u were writing on it then pc shutdown....what u expect? word default setup takes backup file and its mostly in , where u created ur file..not RAM..or not PF...PF is same as RAM but on HDD...and if ur WORD file desnt have a backup file(if u disable from options in word) there is no way to take it back after a shutdown. even if u have 1TB pagefile, u r not going to able to restore so MY opinion is: the thing u r talking about is nonsense. pls do not take offense...just my opinion which cant reflect reality.

Last edited by Mr.Bigtime; 04-23-2009 at 09:49.
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#99)
WhiteLightning
Don Illuminati
 
WhiteLightning's Avatar
 
Videocard: Inno3d GTX 1070 iChill x4
Processor: 2600k HT@4 .5 + NZXT X61
Mainboard: MSI Z77A-GD65 GAMING
Memory: Gskill 2133Mhz 8GB
Soundcard: Onboard
PSU: Seasonic 750 Watt
Default 04-23-2009, 09:46 | posts: 26,568 | Location: Netherlands

Quote:
Originally Posted by smnoamls View Post
This is a gurus forum, you are supposed to figure out the best way to overcharge your OS and hardware.
Just do it based on real information.
Yeah your right about that, there are lots of people here with the right knowledge and experience which saves all the reading up. thank god for that!
   
Reply With Quote
Old
  (#100)
smnoamls
Maha Guru
 
smnoamls's Avatar
 
Videocard: 6950 2gb Dirt3 @6970 bios
Processor: i5 2500k@4.3
Mainboard: Gigabyte z68x ud3
Memory: 8GB gskill
Soundcard: x-fi xtremeGamer
PSU: 620 thermalte PSU
Default 04-23-2009, 10:06 | posts: 1,426 | Location: israel

Quote:
even if u have 1TB pagefile, u r not going to able to restore so MY opinion is: the thing u r talking about is nonsense. pls do not take offense...just my opinion which cant reflect reality.
You are right. It doesnt reflect reality
Vista has a new thing called self healing ntfs.
Basically, NTFS, as compared to other file systems, has a very good chance to restore data in case of power loss. As opposed to ram.
That is why most programs choose to write much of their data on the hard drive ( see posts further up ).
So, when you lose power, yes many game files and data can be saved. It is done automatically by the system often, but more often than not by chkdsk.

Self healing ntfs does it in the background on vista and server 2008 , and without even unmounting the volume ( a wonder of technology really IMO ).
Read more about it :
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/l.../cc771388.aspx

and the basics of NTFS ( which is why xp -> vista use ntfs and not fat32 which is marginally faster ) :
http://www.pcguide.com/ref/hdd/file/ntfs/over.htm
   
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Skin developed by: vBStyles.com
Copyright (c) 2017, All Rights Reserved. The Guru of 3D, the Hardware Guru, and 3D Guru are trademarks owned by Hilbert Hagedoorn.