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  (#26)
iancook221188
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Default 10-15-2016, 10:28 | posts: 1,712 | Location: uk

yer ive just got them too 50% bump on my 2600k
   
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  (#27)
PantherX
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Default 10-15-2016, 10:45 | posts: 1,346

I have read elsewhere (unofficial) that FahCore_a7 is new for CPU and aims to make CPU folding more balanced PPD-wise. If that is indeed the case, we can expect official news soon
   
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  (#28)
ra_alfaomega
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Default 10-15-2016, 10:58 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

Quote:
I have read elsewhere (unofficial) that FahCore_a7 is new for CPU and aims to make CPU folding more balanced PPD-wise. If that is indeed the case, we can expect official news soon
Maybe this core is more efficient than a4 and it's faster, I think the ppd are in relation to the science being made.

Quote:
yer ive just got them too 50% bump on my 2600k
Me too>From 36k to 56K . more than 50%
   
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  (#29)
iancook221188
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Default 10-15-2016, 11:29 | posts: 1,712 | Location: uk

i was gonna stop the cpu folding but this may have changed my mind
   
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  (#30)
PantherX
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Default 10-15-2016, 14:20 | posts: 1,346

I wonder if it uses the AVX/AVX2 for getting better performance. Here are my stats:
CPU:6 when from 25K to 83K with TPF of 41 seconds. I would have to say, it's great news for my system
   
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  (#31)
ra_alfaomega
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Default 10-15-2016, 19:25 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

Quote:
I wonder if it uses the AVX/AVX2 for getting better performance. Here are my stats:
CPU:6 when from 25K to 83K with TPF of 41 seconds. I would have to say, it's great news for my system
Maybe, I don't have AVX/AVX2 on 3930k , and your ppd increased by more than 200%, that's incredible. It seems that the newer cpu's have a greater benefit. But I'm happy with 56k.So a 6950x maybe can get well over 200k.

Quote:
i was gonna stop the cpu folding but this may have changed my mind
Today 01:58
You are right, now I want to fold more on the cpu, than before It was a very big difference between cpu's and gpu's ppd wise. So I understand the sofware behind the core is very important, to get the best of our cpu's.
   
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PantherX
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Default 10-16-2016, 09:28 | posts: 1,346

Quote:
Originally Posted by ra_alfaomega View Post
Maybe, I don't have AVX/AVX2 on 3930k , and your ppd increased by more than 200%, that's incredible. It seems that the newer cpu's have a greater benefit. But I'm happy with 56k.So a 6950x maybe can get well over 200k...
I do like the PPD boost as long as it is related to the science (not an easy thing). My best guess is that they might have an initial trial, see what PPD range is there and may optimize the PPD to reflect the actual science being done. They tend to do it when a new FahCore is released so let's see what happens.

This is another thread from another team discussing FahCore_a7 (http://www.overclock.net/t/1613533/n...f-this-is-news). Seems to me that it is very new so hopefully, can get more details, would be a nice Christmas gift for my CPU
   
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  (#33)
ra_alfaomega
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Default 10-16-2016, 12:46 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

You are right, the ppd must reflect the actual science, anyway if a7 is more efficient, the ppd also have to increase.

So, this new core uses, besides other, the avx, which it seems to have a big impact in the simulation of proteins. In the description of the 11920 project they say are using an old 9752 a4 core project. I remember this project. It was one with the biggest ppd , except bigadv projects. If I remember correctly with cpu:10 at @4,4 gave me in the range of 50k. Now with cpu:10 this "new" project 55-56k. So it's a bit faster than a4, but I think the biggest gain is the use of avx, which I don't have at this cpu .

Thanks for the thread, maybe somebody with avx and 12, 16 or 20 threads can say how much ppd they have. Anyway, my next cpu will be with at least 8/16, and must have avx. I'm wondering if Zen has avx?
   
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ra_alfaomega
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Default 10-16-2016, 12:53 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

Quote:
So it's a bit faster than a4, but I think the biggest gain is the use of avx, which I don't have at this cpu .
I have to correct myself, it seems I have avx, but I don't have avx 2, that's why I don't see a big gain in ppd?
   
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  (#35)
PantherX
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Default 10-17-2016, 05:05 | posts: 1,346

I did remember that PG was looking into AVX support but that was a while back (few years). However, the good news is that "stuff" is happening in the background (https://foldingforum.org/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=28119) so until they officially announce what changes are in FahCore_a7 and/or FahCore_a8, your guess is as good as mine. Given that I got it while not using any flags and there wasn't any blog post about misconfigured server(s), I would say that this is intention so a public announcement could be soonish

I did compare our CPUs (http://ark.intel.com/compare/88195,63697) and have a few thoughts:
1) There is 3 Generation's "performance gap". I have briefly read articles that performance jump between each generation is 5% to 10% but not sure how that relates to F@H performance.
2) i7-6700K has SSE4.1 and AVX2 instructions which yours don't. Not sure if the PPD increase is from SSE4.1 and/or AVX2 instructions.
3) While you use DDR3 and I use DDR4, the difference between RAM timings can't really account for that difference. May be a percentage or two but not more than that unless there's some dramatic changes that I am unaware of.

AMD Zen I do believe might have AVX support natively but AVX2 isn't nativly supported... Until it is released, it might be unclear:
Quote:
...On the FP side there are four pipes (compared to three in previous designs) which support combined 128-bit FMAC instructions. These cannot be combined for one 256-bit AVX2, but can be scheduled for AVX2 over two instructions...
Source (http://www.anandtech.com/show/10591/...-parallelism/2)
Quote:
...The FP Unit uses four pipes rather than three on Excavator, and we are told that the latency in Zen is reduced as well for operations (though more information on this will come at a later date). We have two MUL and two ADD in the FP unit, capable of joining to form two 128-bit FMACs, but not one 256-bit AVX. In order to do AVX, the unit will split the operations accordingly. On the counter side each core will have 2 AES units for cryptography as well as decode support for SSE, AVX1/2, SHA and legacy mmx/x87 compliant code...
Source (http://www.anandtech.com/show/10591/...-parallelism/4)

I guess 2017 might be an awesome year for CPU folding
   
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  (#36)
ra_alfaomega
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Default 10-18-2016, 20:52 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

Interesting information regarding zen but we have almost no clue regarding how zen will do with fah.I hope this new architecture will be a big step for amd to close the distance between them and intel. If on the gpu side we have tons of information regarding the performance, the cpu segment is lacking ppd numbers. That's why is important to inform others about the cpu ppd we have. The cpu folding is important too...
For now I am still happy with my 3930k regardless of lacking SSE4.1 and AVX2. And the fact that intel gains in ipc are very small 5-10% per generation, and the amount of money they charge, in the near future, I don't plan to upgrade. But Zen is interesting and like you said 2017 could be a very exciting year for cpu's...
So, there is an a8 core also?
   
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  (#37)
ra_alfaomega
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Default 10-18-2016, 21:48 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

Project 11920, cpu:12 - 67k tpf 0:47. In the near future I will try at @4,4.
   
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PantherX
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Default 10-19-2016, 07:11 | posts: 1,346

Quote:
Originally Posted by ra_alfaomega View Post
...
For now I am still happy with my 3930k regardless of lacking SSE4.1 and AVX2...
I did dig into the F@H log and found the first time I was assigned a FahCore_a7 WU:
Code:
20:42:36:WU01:FS00:Connecting to 171.67.108.45:8080
20:42:37:WU01:FS00:Assigned to work server 171.64.65.41
20:42:37:WU01:FS00:Requesting new work unit for slot 00: RUNNING cpu:6 from 171.64.65.41
20:42:37:WU01:FS00:Connecting to 171.64.65.41:8080
20:42:38:WU01:FS00:Downloading 20.96MiB
20:42:43:WU01:FS00:Download complete
20:42:43:WU01:FS00:Received Unit: id:01 state:DOWNLOAD error:NO_ERROR project:11920 run:194 clone:0 gen:1 core:0xa7 unit:0x00000001ab40412957bff714d8dbe4fa
20:42:43:WU01:FS00:Downloading core from http://web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah
20:42:43:WU01:FS00:Connecting to web.stanford.edu:80
20:42:43:WU01:FS00:FahCore a7: Downloading 7.35MiB
20:42:49:WU01:FS00:FahCore a7: 27.22%
20:42:55:WU01:FS00:FahCore a7: 59.55%
20:43:01:WU01:FS00:FahCore a7: 91.87%
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:FahCore a7: Download complete
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Valid core signature
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 13.14MiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/FahCore_a7.exe
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 72.16KiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/libbz2-1.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 2.17MiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/libeay32.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 154.79KiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/libexpat-1.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 2.11MiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/libfftw3f-3.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 406.90KiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/ssleay32.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 88.13KiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/zlib1.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 81.28KiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/libgcc_s_seh-1.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 55.64KiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/libwinpthread-1.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Unpacked 1.35MiB to cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/libstdc++-6.dll
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Starting
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Running FahCore: "C:\Program Files (x86)\FAHClient/FAHCoreWrapper.exe" C:/Users/Tweaker/AppData/Roaming/FAHClient/cores/web.stanford.edu/~pande/Win32/AMD64/AVX/Core_a7.fah/FahCore_a7.exe -dir 01 -suffix 01 -version 704 -lifeline 3012 -checkpoint 15 -np 6
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Started FahCore on PID 140
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:Core PID:5712
20:43:02:WU01:FS00:FahCore 0xa7 started
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:*********************** Log Started 2016-10-12T20:43:02Z ***********************
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:************************** Gromacs Folding@home Core ***************************
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       Type: 0xa7
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       Core: Gromacs
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:    Website: http://folding.stanford.edu/
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:  Copyright: (c) 2009-2016 Stanford University
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:     Author: Joseph Coffland <joseph@cauldrondevelopment.com>
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       Args: -dir 01 -suffix 01 -version 704 -lifeline 140 -checkpoint 15 -np 6
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:     Config: <none>
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:************************************ Build *************************************
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:    Version: 0.0.11
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       Date: Sep 21 2016
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       Time: 01:43:48
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7: Repository: Git
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:   Revision: 957bd90e68d95ddcf1594dc15ff6c64cc4555146
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:     Branch: master
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:   Compiler: GNU 4.2.1 Compatible Clang 3.9.0 (trunk 274080)
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:    Options: -std=gnu++98 -O3 -funroll-loops -ffast-math -mfpmath=sse
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:             -fno-unsafe-math-optimizations -msse2 -I/mingw64/include
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:             -Wno-inconsistent-dllimport -Wno-parentheses-equality
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:             -Wno-deprecated-register -Wno-unused-local-typedef
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:   Platform: linux2 4.6.0-1-amd64
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       Bits: 64
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       Mode: Release
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       SIMD: avx_256
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:************************************ System ************************************
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:        CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-6700K CPU @ 4.00GHz
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:     CPU ID: GenuineIntel Family 6 Model 94 Stepping 3
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:       CPUs: 8
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:     Memory: 31.93GiB
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Free Memory: 28.83GiB
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:    Threads: WINDOWS_THREADS
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7: OS Version: 6.2
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Has Battery: false
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7: On Battery: false
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7: UTC Offset: 13
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:        PID: 5712
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:        CWD: C:\Users\Tweaker\AppData\Roaming\FAHClient\work
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:         OS: Windows 10 Pro
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:    OS Arch: AMD64
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:********************************************************************************
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Project: 11920 (Run 194, Clone 0, Gen 1)
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Unit: 0x00000001ab40412957bff714d8dbe4fa
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Reading tar file core.xml
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Reading tar file frame1.tpr
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Digital signatures verified
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Calling: mdrun -s frame1.tpr -o frame1.trr -cpt 15 -nt 6
20:43:03:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Steps: first=80000 total=80000
20:43:05:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Completed 1 out of 80000 steps (0%)
20:43:46:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Completed 800 out of 80000 steps (1%)
20:44:27:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Completed 1600 out of 80000 steps (2%)
20:45:09:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Completed 2400 out of 80000 steps (3%)
20:45:49:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Completed 3200 out of 80000 steps (4%)
20:46:30:WU01:FS00:0xa7:Completed 4000 out of 80000 steps (5%)
While I haven't gotten the knowledge to decode the flags of the compiler, I did come across this:
SIMD: avx_256
Now I am unsure if this is AVX or AVX2 as the Wikipedia isn't very clear about that and the few threads that I have read about, aren't very clear about it :/

Moreover, this FahCore is under a month old which is great:
Date: Sep 21 2016

Hopefully, they can give us an early Christmas gift by announcing an AVX and/or AVX2 FahCore along with a new FahClient (currently it is undergoing open Public Beta).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ra_alfaomega View Post
...So, there is an a8 core also?
According to the F@H thread and the project information (http://fah-web.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/...banned?p=11900), yep but that could be an internal build or a typo. My best guess is that FahCore_a7 is AVX while FahCore_a8 is AVX2. However, it is just a guess
   
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  (#39)
Athlonite
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Default 12-22-2016, 03:54 | posts: 1,070 | Location: Hawkes Bay

I'm only a couple of WU's in on my RX480 and it's getting 346174 PPD and my cpu is getting 10170 PPD

fairly big step up from my R9 285 on 0x21 core

@ PantherX
I've never seen an 0xa7 or a8 core WU always with the 0xa4



Last edited by Athlonite; 12-22-2016 at 03:59.
   
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  (#40)
ra_alfaomega
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Default 12-28-2016, 11:22 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

Quote:
my RX480 and it's getting 346174 PPD
That's very good. That's more than 3x what I used to get with 270x. And it's half of my 1070.
You will have a great contribution to fah with your RX480

Quote:
I've never seen an 0xa7 or a8 core WU always with the 0xa4
I don't know why, but I know that for several days I didn't received an a7 core project, maybe because I fold just 1-2 projects per day with my cpu, and the chances to get one are slim. Regarding a8 I never received this kind of WU.
   
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  (#41)
PantherX
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Default 12-28-2016, 21:41 | posts: 1,346

I did get quite a few FahCore_a7 WUs but that was all from a single Project. However, since it is the future of CPU folding, we all will eventually get it
   
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  (#42)
ra_alfaomega
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Default 02-23-2017, 13:11 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

A new a7 core project just appeared, and at least with my 3930k@4,2 and cpu:10, I get 77k ppd. That's the best ppd that I received from a cpu project, besides bigadv. I am curious what a newer cpu( skylake, or kaby lake) can get out of this project, maybe over 100k ppd.

Last edited by ra_alfaomega; 02-23-2017 at 14:28.
   
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iancook221188
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Default 02-23-2017, 22:03 | posts: 1,712 | Location: uk

looking good ra_alfaomega very interesting
   
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yasamoka
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Default 02-23-2017, 23:26 | posts: 4,205 | Location: Lebanon

Let's see how Ryzen would do with CPU folding!
   
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ra_alfaomega
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Default 02-24-2017, 19:14 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

I am also curious about Ryzen.... In the meantime, project 13800, 82k ppd,with cpu:10 and folding with gpu in the same time.
   
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sykozis
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Default 03-13-2017, 04:31 | posts: 19,764 | Location: US East Coast

Quote:
Originally Posted by yasamoka View Post
Let's see how Ryzen would do with CPU folding!
Once funding, and the Ryzen 5 1600 is available, I may give Ryzen a try. I haven't run F@H since Oct '15.... If I can find the necessary data, I may resume folding soon.


   
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ra_alfaomega
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Default 03-13-2017, 19:38 | posts: 119 | Location: Romania,Brasov

Regarding Ryzen ppd, 1800x in a7 projects can get up to 120-130k, stock clocks. Overclocked can give you higher ppd, maybe is in the range of a 6900k. Even if Intel is 10% faster, the price it's in the favor of amd, and even if I don't have information on 1700, I have a guess that overclocked to 3,8-4 , can have the same ppd as 1800x and for a much lower cost. Time will show us more information.
It would be good to have you back, sykozis, and with ryzen reinforcements, too
   
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sykozis
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Default 03-20-2017, 03:05 | posts: 19,764 | Location: US East Coast

I had F@H up and running for a couple days. Appears my RX 470 is on par with the GTX970 it replaced for PPD. Both, on average, manage around 250K PPD.... Need to take a look at my waterloop though. CPU temps were a bit high at 68C...which is quite funny since no other stress test has pushed it beyond 54C....


   
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PantherX
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Default 03-21-2017, 08:32 | posts: 1,346

Quote:
Originally Posted by sykozis View Post
...Need to take a look at my waterloop though. CPU temps were a bit high at 68C...which is quite funny since no other stress test has pushed it beyond 54C....
If you were folding a FahCore_a7 WU then it does make sense as it uses AVX (maybe AVX2 but am not 100% sure).
   
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