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Odellot
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Default 05-05-2012, 00:20 | posts: 247 | Location: Philippines

So it isn't really worth it to upgrade to 3770k from my 2600k 5.0?
   
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cowie
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Default 05-05-2012, 00:25 | posts: 11,864 | Location: new jersey

Looking at it from a gamer i highly dought you would know if your cpu was a sb or ivy.

The thing that sb is good for is easy high overclocks on air...never know even you might have a high multi sb chip you dont realise.
Now ivy's thing is to have to be on pluto to overclock well, hmmmm seems back to normal to me.
   
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Anarion
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Default 05-05-2012, 00:34 | posts: 10,727 | Location: Finland

Quote:
Originally Posted by Odellot View Post
So it isn't really worth it to upgrade to 3770k from my 2600k 5.0?
Let's put it this way, why would you upgrade? There isn't going to be any noticeable difference. Sure, this is faster than my old 2600K at same clock speed in benchmarks at least but do I notice it? No. If you had to but new stuff then IB is obvious choice (like in my case) but just upgrading isn't worth it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ---TK--- View Post
a toasty 4.8ish maybe?
According to Muropaketti.com tests, 4700 MHz is equal. At least in povray2.
   
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---TK---
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Default 05-05-2012, 00:35 | posts: 17,827 | Location: New Jersey, USA

in just that bench or all benches?
   
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  (#55)
TechFreaK
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Default 05-05-2012, 01:29 | posts: 155 | Location: TechLand

Quote:
Originally Posted by ---TK--- View Post
that bench is skewed 100 mhz in favor of IB. do you have a bench at the same clocks?
edit heres a 2700k vs 3770k both at stock 3.5ghz
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...k,3181-24.html

on this last link cycle though next page to see gaming benches
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...k,3181-20.html
It was the closest thing, next is 3820 vs 3770k
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/523?vs=551


this at hardware canucks looks good
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum...review-17.html

Btw, 2600K + 100mhz OC won't boost min 92fps to 100fps like in this review 2600k vs 3770k.. And if you check OC'ed results you can see 3770K @ 4.8ghz matches 2600k @ 5ghz
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/201...3770k-review/7

Imo 3770k is ~ 5-6fps faster compared to 2700k or 200mhz more efficient.

Last edited by TechFreaK; 05-05-2012 at 01:32.
   
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---TK---
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Default 05-05-2012, 02:43 | posts: 17,827 | Location: New Jersey, USA

if you looked at my second link its probably 2-3 fps on avg at best, with many game benches showing very little difference. 1st link showed a less than 5% avg improvement. problem is you are not going to get the 3770k to 4.8ghz on the same air cooler or low end enclosed water as the 2600k at 5ghz. the i5 in cowies futurmark benches were quite toasty on a 4c 4t chip. p95 would be near 100c. add 7-10c per core for a 3770k HT on prime 95.

Last edited by ---TK---; 05-05-2012 at 02:48.
   
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cowie
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Default 05-05-2012, 23:34 | posts: 11,864 | Location: new jersey

You know i was just realising that my 3930k ht on in vantage ran cooler(h100) then this 3570K?... anyways..

had it cold today
It went 5.44 with 1.60V @-65C for 3d06,got alittle more for other benches

more volts dont help it after 1.65v with the temps i had...did try to throw 1.70v at it but no help,did not take any ss's to speak of thuo just messing around.
Now i have to go colder with ln2 that means airgas and getting screwed on ln2.
$20 worth of dice gives me 6hrs(3hrs today 10lbs) even with this chip,with ln2 6hrs is 300usd.
not bitching just saying.... nah i'm bitching.
sry for the big screens last time deltatux


i could do this speed at lower volts but just playing to see how high i could boot and the combos reaction.
So far on dice i miss my 56x 2500k for dx3d hell my 2600k on air gives this chip a run for its money going by the 3d i did today,hope i can do better next time.

Last edited by cowie; 05-06-2012 at 01:02.
   
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  (#58)
Darkest
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Default 05-06-2012, 00:39 | posts: 7,224

One of my Core2 setups went kaput and luckily coincided with the Ivy Bridge launch. The 3570k was roughly the same price as the 2500k, so it was a no brainer to me. Compared to the Core2 I was running, this thing is far superior. I also have no plans on doing extreme OC's like the very nice 5.5ghz cowie has just above =p

People tend to forget that heat doesn't become a problem with Ivy Bridge until you start bumping the voltage up beyond a certain level. Prior to doing that Ivy should generally be no hotter than Sandy, and often even a little cooler. If you're going for a mild OC around the 4-4.4ghz range (which I imagine most chips can manage) you're better off going with Ivy. Not enough to upgrade from a Sandy bridge, but for those of us that were running older hardware certainly.
   
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cowie
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Default 05-06-2012, 00:59 | posts: 11,864 | Location: new jersey

True i can go 4.2 on normal quite fan on stock voltage 1.20v
4.4ish only took 1.28v-1.31v and stayed ok on temps under stress,but after 1.35v its a different story
maybe ok for short periods of time if you keep on eye on temps for a bench or two but not worth the heat to go after 4.6+ for long
just what i seen on this chip, ofcoarse they are all alittle different in that respect.
   
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---TK---
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Default 05-06-2012, 01:04 | posts: 17,827 | Location: New Jersey, USA

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkest View Post
One of my Core2 setups went kaput and luckily coincided with the Ivy Bridge launch. The 3570k was roughly the same price as the 2500k, so it was a no brainer to me. Compared to the Core2 I was running, this thing is far superior. I also have no plans on doing extreme OC's like the very nice 5.5ghz cowie has just above =p

People tend to forget that heat doesn't become a problem with Ivy Bridge until you start bumping the voltage up beyond a certain level. Prior to doing that Ivy should generally be no hotter than Sandy, and often even a little cooler. If you're going for a mild OC around the 4-4.4ghz range (which I imagine most chips can manage) you're better off going with Ivy. Not enough to upgrade from a Sandy bridge, but for those of us that were running older hardware certainly.
dont think there is one poster in this thread that does not know that. I tend to overclock higher than just a minor oc. I run 4.7-4.8 on air completely stable with an average volt hungry SB. theres no way I can run an IB that high on my cooler. I would have to run around 4.4 to 4.5 and that negates any IB performance increase I would get.
   
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Darkest
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Default 05-06-2012, 01:10 | posts: 7,224

Quote:
Originally Posted by ---TK--- View Post
dont think there is one poster in this thread that does not know that. I tend to overclock higher than just a minor oc. I run 4.7-4.8 on air completely stable with an average volt hungry SB. theres no way I can run an IB that high on my cooler. I would have to run around 4.4 to 4.5 and that negates any IB performance increase I would get.
Maybe not in this thread, I was making a broader generalization - as it's certainly evident across most forums I frequent and discussions I've read. There's a strong misconception out there with many that Ivy = Hot so it's automatically worse than Sandy. Often times the people coming out with such things are sat with minor OC's.

Of course if you intend to run a higher OC it's going to be a problem. But then upgrading to Ivy from Sandy seems utterly pointless to me in pretty much all scenarios. In some cases (such as you've stated) it may even result in a downgrade.

Last edited by Darkest; 05-06-2012 at 01:12.
   
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cowie
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Default 05-06-2012, 01:15 | posts: 11,864 | Location: new jersey

Yeah you had a c2,so you got the newest chip i dont blame ya.
honestly its hard to beat a sb chip in oc to temp ratio thuo
   
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---TK---
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Default 05-06-2012, 01:19 | posts: 17,827 | Location: New Jersey, USA

hey cowie you gettin a 690?
   
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Default 05-06-2012, 06:54 | posts: 7,068

I went Ivy because i considered an upgrade of my i7 920. But really if you got Core2Duo or something like that or AMD Athlon x2 then this upgrade is worth it.

I am forced for a few weeks to use the integrated IGP - intel hd 4000.
One of the questions i see here a lot is: "Will it run Crysis?" Well I can tell you that indeed, it CAN run Crysis on low settings, and it does not even stutter on those, maybe sometimes in heavy deep jungle maps (I play MechWarrior: Living Legends).

Last edited by Sash; 05-06-2012 at 06:58.
   
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thatguy91
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Default 05-06-2012, 07:36 | posts: 3,723 | Location: Australia

I would still like to know about the whole i7-3770k vs i5-3570K argument. Like I have said in other threads I have no idea which one is actually better! there doesn't seem to be a consistency between the reviews. Some show the i7-3770K to be noticeably better than the i5-3570K (by noticeably I mean just that, not that its different in a large sense), and others show the i7-3770K performing basically the same especially if you take into account clock speed.
   
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Sash
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Default 05-06-2012, 07:46 | posts: 7,068

its simple, i5 does not have HT, i7 has. performance is limited to application's multicore support!
   
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Loobyluggs
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Default 05-06-2012, 08:03 | posts: 1,112 | Location: UK

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mufflore View Post
I recommend a new MB with a SandyBridge CPU.
If you don't keep your PC clean, IB is not the better solution.
I kinda do and don't; I check inside to see if the gfx card is clogged up (now) and whether there are any large clumps of dust I can remove, but generally don't check inside more than once every 3 months unless it starts spluttering.

PC's are pretty robust tech. All this cleaning is pretty unnecessary imo and don't get me wrong, I do think it's nice to have a clean rig, but mostly it won't make a difference.

Anyway, going liquid cooled for new IB, so w/e.
   
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thatguy91
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Default 05-06-2012, 08:30 | posts: 3,723 | Location: Australia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sash View Post
its simple, i5 does not have HT, i7 has. performance is limited to application's multicore support!
Oh I know that but doesn't i7 also have 2MB extra L2 cache?
   
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Sash
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Default 05-06-2012, 08:31 | posts: 7,068

Quote:
Originally Posted by thatguy91 View Post
Oh I know that but doesn't i7 also have 2MB extra L2 cache?
maybe not enough to create a significant boost in performance score numbers
   
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thatguy91
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Default 05-06-2012, 09:32 | posts: 3,723 | Location: Australia

I do a lot of video encoding using staxrip, x264 etc (with over the top quality settings like subme 10, 24 search range, ME UMH etc, so I'm guessing the i7 would provide an advantage. A lot of the benchmarks either use old versions of x264, or programs that have other limiting factors such as the speed of the inbuilt filters etc.

Basically, I want to know in realistic terms the benefit to me of an i7-3770K vs i5-3570K, and whether its worth the 50 percent price premium (which I think should be closer to 20 percent even if Intel were still profiteering). Its difficult to tell by the reviews due to the great variation between reviews.

I should also point out I run two occurrences of Staxrip concurrently to maximise CPU use on my Q9400. At low priority even though it makes for task manager to show 100 percent, and the combined framerate of encoding higher, it doesn't really slow down the system. I was playing MW3 for a several hours before I remembered I was encoding! (basically MW3 and priorities etc meant encoding was very limited in speed)...

What I am saying is due to the multiple encoding instances thread utilisation isn't a concern. Its probably the limiting factor in the reviews of i5 vs i7, as I can guess that there is a higher utilisation percentage wise on the i5 than the i7... But then it comes back to the cpu utilisation question, isn't 100 percent CPU use (effectively) on the i5 basically the same as 100 percent utilisation on the i7, performance wise? since you are maxing out the threads on both, and the idea of HT is to maximise CPU usage with multithreaded apps?

Sorry for the long winded explanation, but I guess you can see why I'm asking - its a complex decision without knowing what benefits each provides!

If the i7 performs in the above situation and games practically the same as an i5, I would rather spend that money on better other components.
   
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cowie
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Default 05-06-2012, 11:16 | posts: 11,864 | Location: new jersey

^then get a non ht i5
Quote:
Originally Posted by ---TK--- View Post
hey cowie you gettin a 690?
Hell no i want one of those dcII or lightnings

Last edited by cowie; 05-06-2012 at 11:18.
   
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Postalisback
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Default 05-06-2012, 22:17 | posts: 3,600 | Location: Narnia

Nope not getting IB, happy with my SB i5 2400
   
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Vxheous
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Default 05-06-2012, 23:26 | posts: 1,259 | Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Cowie, I couldn't get my 3570K to POST 4.4Ghz on 1.2V, ended up just making a jump straight to 1.275V, and it's rock stable, though I think I'm going to spend some time either tonight or tomorrow dialing down my voltage. Real Temps is giving me ~75C average while under load in Prime95.
   
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pimp_gimp
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Default 05-06-2012, 23:27 | posts: 5,837 | Location: Tacoma, Washington

Quote:
Originally Posted by Octavean View Post
Yeah, I was referring to Newegg as their price for the Ivy Bridge Core i7 3770K is $349.99 USD. Microcenter has the 3770K for something like ~$289.99 which is a decent price IMO but it doesn’t solve the heat / OC issue. Newegg has a habit of overcharging for new hardware such a s the 3770K whereas Microcenter typically undercuts the MSRP.

BTW, just between you me and the world wide web, I half suspect Intel decided to go with cheap thermal past between the core and the heat spreader on Ivy Bridge for a very good reason. Maybe Fluxless solder adhering to the core and spreader at repeated high temp might pull the chip right off LGA1155 package. The spreader expands with heat and contracts when cooling, if the chip is fused to the spreader it could weaken its mount to the LGA1155 package when it goes through the heating / cooling process.
Newegg isn't the only one jacking up the price $32, Amazon, and Tigerdirect have as well. Honestly, if I feel the need for Ivy Bridge, I'll wait for a revision and price drop.
   
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  (#75)
GhostXL
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Default 05-07-2012, 00:03 | posts: 5,469 | Location: PA, USA

I got mine from Newegg for $325 bucks. It said 400 with a slash through it and final cost was $325.

I'm very happy with this purchase.
   
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