What happens if you install a 2 GB video card on a 32-bit OS?

Discussion in 'Operating Systems' started by heymian, Sep 15, 2013.

  1. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    ^Then your motherboard doesn't support remapping.
     
  2. gammelhat

    gammelhat Active Member

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    It doesn't matter. In non-server editions of Windows all access to memory above 4GB has been cut off. So remapped memory will not be available. So you will always have less than 4GB available.
     
  3. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    That's not true.
    Remapping isn't done by the OS it's done by the BIOS before the OS loads. Windows has nothing to do with it.

    Edit:
    I know what MSDN says btw, but that info is wrong. I have yet to see an OS that doesn't support PAE.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2013
  4. gammelhat

    gammelhat Active Member

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    Yes, remapping is done by bios/hardware. The point is that remapped memory is addressed above 4G, so the OS will not be able to get to it. So even with remapping enabled, you will have less than 4 GB system ram.

    MMIO is still located below 4G.
     

  5. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    ^Yep - I updated my post to cover that....
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2013
  6. gammelhat

    gammelhat Active Member

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    yes, there is a PAE kernel present, but it is crippled. It doesn't allow access to memory above 4G. So it will not help in the matter.

    You will need special written software to make use of the memory. Like some ramdisks.
     
  7. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    ^Sorry you ninja'd me....lol I'll repost what I said:

    I think the 4GB part is wrong.
    I'm pretty sure it's whatever amount of physical memory is installed and people like Mark R assume everyone will use 4GB.

    The reason I say this is the exact same thing happens on any motherboard with a 64bit OS, 8-24GB ram and remapping disabled - the ram disappears from the BIOS.
     
  8. CPC_RedDawn

    CPC_RedDawn Ancient Guru

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    You sure about that?

    I remember back in the Core 2 days when I had a Q6600 G0 and 4GB RAM I installed a 4870x2 into that and my 4GB system memory dropped down to 3.25GB even though the 4870x2 had 2GB VRAM (1GB per GPU) so it should have technically dropped down to 3.0GB RAM and yes I did have PAE enabled and remapping in BIOS. Upgraded to Vista x64 from XP x86 and I had my full 4GB system RAM back.

    Maybe I did something wrong but both Remapping and PAE where enabled.
     
  9. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    Fwiw, the amount of vram on the card is not specifically the amount which is reserved by windows.

    I'm not sure the exact amount it may be 512 or so -I have no idea tbh but it's not equal to vram.... I think after SP3 WMM (memory manager) mirrors the frame buffer in system memory too, which is prob what Mk was referring to earlier.

    Honestly I haven't dealt with that stuff in years so there' a lot I don't remember about the subsystem.

    About your PAE question -
    If you had a card installed and all 4gb showed then lost some with the 4870X2, my guess is the BIOS either didn't remap into a high enough address space or maybe it could only remap 1 card, since the X2 is really 2 cards.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2013
  10. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    Sure, that's what MSDN says. ;) Anyone can read the library.

    When it comes to real world implementation things can be quite different. I've seen the evidence with my own 2 eyes and I know this is not true.

    At least not across the board.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2013

  11. gammelhat

    gammelhat Active Member

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    You will need to go back to XP SP1, before that is true. Back then Windows allowed fully 4GB of system ram. If it needed to go beyond 4G-addressing to reach that, it would.

    Today you will not get 4 GB usable system ram. That is also why google is filled with links to the 3.x/2.x-issue. Remapping will not solve it.
     
  12. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    That only applies to Physically Installed RAM not virtual memory.

    Remapping uses virtual address space which is def not limited to 4GB and neither is Windows.

    Many motherboards and all X86 CPU's do not support remapping this is the most common reason for low reported memory.
     
  13. gammelhat

    gammelhat Active Member

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    Physically installed ram is addressed through the physical address space. The virtual address space is not in any way related to this. Memory remapping is about physical addressing.

    This doesn't need to be a guessing contest. Both AMD and Intel offer hardware reference manuals where they describe how their implementation of memory remapping works.
     
  14. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    Oh Christ man, I'm not gonna argue with you about this. You are wrong. You. are. wrong.

    You can go and read whatever you want on Technet or MSDN and then repeat it here till the cows home but it won't change a thing, because I see this in person.

    I've see many many many systems with XP that have no problem reporting 4GB or more ram.

    What is there left to debate? That I'm lying? That I imagined it? Jesus....
     
  15. gammelhat

    gammelhat Active Member

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    If you actually knew anything about this, you would at this point dig into a hardware reference manual pointing out what is correct and what is not, but you cannot do that. You can only act like a child.
     

  16. The Goose

    The Goose Ancient Guru

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    you will have 3> + 2 gig vid
     
  17. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    . Why?
    You would just keep arguing like you usually do. So if I'm acting childish...what does that make you?

    You seem to be reading up stuff on Technet or whatever then coming back here to test me.

    Much of what u posted is almost word for word what is written in the msdn library, yet you clearly don't understand the most basic principles of Windows Memory Management.

    Like total addressable memory which includes physical and virtual. All you had to do was look in look in Task Manger to know that.
    And also claiming XP has 4GB total available memory and that PAE/AWE is disabled. PAE is disabled for installed memory only

    And you also misunderstand PAE, there are 2 types of PAE hardware and software. The hardware must support PAE or remapping will not work.

    If it does support remapping and there is still missing memory...it's possibly a driver issue. If it's not that, then I have no clue why all ram doesn't show, but remapping does work.


    Many X86 systems have no trouble with 4GB ram. I have seen them, unlike you.


    Anyway, what I'm about to post you could have easily found yourself in about 2mins.
    But no...instead I have to dig around and upload images and other crap I'd rather not do just to satisfy your boredom.


    A 32bit OS can handle something like 128GB addressable memory iirc....I forget the exact amount but I do know it's not 4GB as you crapped on about...


    As you can see it's 3GB for EACH 32bit process.....so do the maths.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]



    Please note the word PHYSICAL in the screenshot below. Physical means INSTALLED RAM, as I tried to explain to u earlier.

    [​IMG]


    ^This page was updated 2mths ago to include the highlighted bottom paragraph. Please read it carefully.


    That is a load of crap. All memory, physical or not - has a virtual address.

    I should be charging you for the education you're getting right now.

    Read below

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]


    Now, have I satisfied you enough so that I can go enjoy my weekend? I have other things I rather do.....
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
  18. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    That's not how it works.
     
  19. thatguy91

    thatguy91 Guest

    The OP has an i5 at 3.7 GHz and a GTX 670 2GB video card. It think the same answer would be to change over to 8 GB of system ram and install Windows x64. Windows x64 (regardless of whether it is 7, 8 etc) uses the same keys as Windows x86. The license covers the key, not the installation media. Therefore, you can legally download the appropriate Windows x64 ISO and use that. By download I mean through something like a digital river link (which you can find online), they aren't blocked for download simply because it is just the ISO, and not the key.
     
  20. Pill Monster

    Pill Monster Banned

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    Man MS are useless pricks. Just as useless as they were 10yrs ago....

    There is so muchconflicting info about Memory and PAE and whatnot on their sites it's impossible to get a clear picture of anything.

    Only way u can verify what they say is by doing it, since their info sucks donkey dick...... I can see why people would be misinformed.

    That hasn't changed in years....
     

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